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  1. David
  2. Sherlock Holmes
  3. MOTIFXF
  4. Friday, 27 March 2020
I have some songs which I saved as an "All" file sometime ago. These songs had sample data (audio tracks). Now when I load the files from the USB stick onto which they are stored , the sample data is missing. I am loading the file as "all”. Any ideas where I'm going wrong? I do have a flash drive, and it's possible I saved the sample data there, and then subsequently erased it. But wouldn't it still be on the USB file? Or maybe not , if the save flash drive was set to" without sample." hmmm...

Some related questions:
When I am loading an All file, sometimes I get a message that says no sampling data. So then I go and change the load flash drive parameter to "none", and then it works. What is going on there? My best guess is that my flash drive data can be saved onto a USB drive. When you load, it's asking you where you want that data to go. If there is no such data, the error message occurs. Am I on the right track?

Well I can't remember what my other question is so I'll leave it at that.

Thanks,
David
Responses (6)
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
In deciphering what is actually contained in your Motif XF All Data File, you need only look to the name and size of the file. This you can see by press [FILE] and exploring the USB stick’s Directory.

Each File can have a name that you compose, and the Motif XF System adds the extensions. These follow the name and consist of either:
.n1.x3a
.n2.x3a
.n3.x3a

Followed by the File Size. Let us know.
The extensions identify where to look for the Waveforms and Samples, and the size will give us a clue if any samples are contained within the file.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MOTIFXF
  3. # 1
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Well, I feel foolish. It turns out I did not save the aforementioned files as "all" but rather as" all songs."
I do have some waveform files saved and I see that they take up a lot more data space, as you suggested.

Here's a follow up question :
If I save waveform data to the flash expansion module, will that data be saved to my USB device if I do a save all? And would this be the best way to do it?
Thanks,
Dave
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MOTIFXF
  3. # 2
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Yes, Saving All guarantees that your XF data is saved... including Waveforms and Samples in the internal SDRAM (USR) is 128MB. However, because of the size of each Flash Board (either 512MB or 1024MB), you can make a decision about whether or not you want to Save all the very large audio data.

When talking about Waveforms and Samples... at first you think of them together. But they are two different terms with separate definitions.
A Waveform is a set of parameters that organize audio samples. Their data size is small.
Samples are audio data and their data size can be huge.

As an example, the sample data of the Yamaha S700 acoustic grand (the one made popular in the S90 ES) was about 53MB. It was made up of 3 Waveforms. The first was a collection of 90 soft-strike samples across the keyboard, the second was a collection of 90 medium strike samples across the keyboard, and the third was a collection of 90 hard-strike samples across the keyboard. The data size of the parameters that map the samples into Key and Velocity Ranges (called KeyBanks) and that define play behavior add up to maybe a couple kilobytes 2KB, while the audio being organized is 53MB. (Approx. 2KB of Waveform parameters and 53MB of Samples)

The Waveform list is always saved (small size allows for this). They are “pointers” that direct the engine to the sampled audio’s physical location in Flash Memory.
The Samples due to their size... you are given the option to Save either with/without.

Save ALL
ALL data (.X3A) - an ALL data file saves everything in the Motif XF just as you have it. ALL means everything, in this case whatever you have on your volatile SDRAM will be saved as “USR”, whatever you have on your FL1 board will be saved as “FL1”, and whatever you have on your FL2 board will be saved as “FL2”, unless you opt not to save that data.

You will be given two options for each FL boards when you select SAVE TYPE = ALL

SAVE FL1 “with sample” or “without sample”
SAVE FL2 “with sample” or “without sample”

There is no option for the USR (SDRAM) as that sample data will always be saved…

Here’s why: SDRAM at maximum will only be 128MB, while the FL1 and FL2 could be quite larger, depending on the size of the Boards you have installed in the slots. Also it takes quite a bit more time to install data on the Flash boards than it does to load data to RAM. A file of 128 MB is loaded in about 45 seconds into the SDRAM. Installing/loading (called ‘burning’ the ROM) the same file into the permanent Flash Memory will take about 5 minutes. Due to technical reasons. the installation of User Waveforms and Samples into the Flash Memory takes significantly more time than loading same into the SDRAM.

Extra Credit:
You may wonder about the options to SAVE FL1/FL2 “with samples” or “without samples”?
Because some users of the Flash board technology will use them as a home for the Samples and Waveform data that they want to keep permanently - so once you have installed data to a FLASH board, they don’t need to SAVE the entire contents every time they make a small change to your other data. Say you have 500MB of your absolute favorite data on your FL1 board. That data will stay there for as long as you desire (you have to DELETE it or FORMAT the board to get rid of it - you cannot OVERWRITE it, not by mistake, not on purpose). If all you are doing is tweaking a drum phrase in PATTERN 23, and you want to update your ALL data file. Do you really want to wait for 500MB to be written to that ALL data file? No... you’d opt to Save *without* the samples... this means you can restore the All file in less than 45 seconds, rather than having to wait several minutes (coffee break).
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MOTIFXF
  3. # 3
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Thank you for that clarifying response.

If I may inquire further,
Given that sample data loads faster to sdram then to the flash expansion, it would seem more logical to do it that way when saving audio in song or pattern mode. That is, not bother with the flash at all. Is there a situation where it is advantageous to save song audio to the flash drive?
I could see saving to the flash module when one is sampling for the purpose of creating new voices or waveforms, on the other hand. For example, maybe you want your favorite homemade samples accessible at all times.

In general what I'd like to know is: what are some effective ways of making use of the flash expansion module? What do people do with it?

Thanks again,
David
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MOTIFXF
  3. # 4
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Given that sample data loads faster to sdram then to the flash expansion, it would seem more logical to do it that way when saving audio in song or pattern mode. That is, not bother with the flash at all. Is there a situation where it is advantageous to save song audio to the flash drive?
Your mileage will vary. SDRAM holds a bit more than 12 minutes of total audio. A Flash Board hold over 50 minutes or over 100 minutes of total audio.

If your gig requires lots of audio samples, loops, and clips, you might opt to load them to Flash — where they would always be accessible same as the factory Waveforms.

It depends on how you use the memory... if you are mainly sampling vocals or using long clips like guitar solos, your view of the memory will be different from someone using it for drum and percussion hits.

Where you load your data is a personal preference, and it should always be based on what works best for you.

Say you have a couple of samples of electric and acoustic guitars that run throughout the composition. You would probably do well to burn these to the Flash Board — where the audio would remain always available. Loading the Song or Pattern that uses those samples literally loads in 2 seconds, Two seconds. Remember, if the samples are in place you can be very very very efficient in loading Songs.

When the big audio samples are in place, load time ceases to be an issue. I have a song with a long lead vocal track. I installed the vocal to a Flash Board when I want to play the Song, it’s quick and easy to get going ... 2 seconds.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MOTIFXF
  3. # 5
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
It’s making a whole lot more sense to me now. Thanks,
Bad Mister, for sharing your expertise.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MOTIFXF
  3. # 6
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