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  1. David
  2. MONTAGE Series Synthesizers
  3. Monday, 25 January 2021
Hello,

Just purchased a Montage 8 (well, actually, it was a Christmas present from a generous wife! :p ). I also had purchased Cubase Pro a few years ago when Cakewalk went through it's changes, but had still been using Cakewalk. Since the Montage integrates better with Cubase, I'm ready to make Cubase my primary DAW, and I updated to Cubase Pro 11 yesterday.

In any case, Bad Mister's video seems to illustrate the steps to connect the Montage with Cubase AI, since AI is included with a Montage purchase. To connect the Montage with Cubase Pro 11, as the interface looks a little different, I thought I should click on Studio->More Options->Midi Device Manager->Install Device. I see many synths/keyboards listed, but couldn't find Montage. I did see Yamaha MO (Yamaha). Is this for the Montage, or do I choose Define New, or am I way off in my thinking?

Also, how would I then connect the Montage to Cubase for audio?

Thanks for any input,

cohenville
Responses (24)
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
the Soprano Sax part I had used (I believe it was the Mellow Soprano the first time around), does not sound as authentic as before


This information is not sufficient to determine what is causing the difference in sound. "... as before" does not detail how the soprano sax sound was used before when it sounded fine.

My assumption was "before" the soprano sax was recalled from a factory preset that only had the soprano sound by itself. And "after" the soprano sound was merged into an existing performance. If this is true - then the types of differences that occur in this case are fairly clear. If this is not true, then there's a different path to take.

If true - then the two items BM pointed out are the two reasons why sounds are different when merged. System effects are bound to be different when you "transplant" a sound from its original Performance into a new/different Performance. And also if the sound you are using originally had Part-level or even Performance-level assignable knobs that alter the sound - then these are also going to be "lost" during the transplant. It's the doctor's job to do some reconstructive surgery.

As one method to manage your Frankenstein ...

Sometimes one sound is more altered than another by merging (transplanting). Whenever creating a "Frankenstein" Performance - one where you merge in one or more sounds to an original sound - you always start with the first sound which is unaltered.

Your keyboard instrument seems like on Part 1, Bass on Part 2, and so on. So the keyboard Part is the unaltered one that defines the system effects available for all other transplanted sounds and also has its superknob/assignable knobs all in tact.

If you instead start with the soprano as the 1st Performance - then it will have all of its knobs and system effects in-tact. Then merge in the keyboard/bass/etc. You'll be now possibly creating a different sounding keyboard - but it may not be as noticeable depending on what your ears need to hear.

If this interpretation of "before" and "after" doesn't fit - then there may be some other types of things going on.

Regards,
Jason
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
In short: select the Mellow Sax part in your newly configured performance by tapping on it, or any of the other ways to select it. Set knobs to Tone by tapping the Tone button (highest button on your keyboard, above the knobs) and swivel Cutoff all the way to the right (the first knob). That might have been what you'd previously done to it, via the Super Knob or Assignable Knob One, to make it sound 'breathier".
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
The new Performance I created was to clone the instruments I had chosen for the original Performance that I had not understood I needed to save. I noticed however, that this time around the Soprano Sax part I had used (I believe it was the Mellow Soprano the first time around), does not sound as authentic as before (and this is the case regardless of whether Cubase is involved or not). In other words, previously, the Soprano Sax Part had a relatively convincing, breathy Sax sound - which we all know is difficult to simulate on a keyboard. Now, however, it sounds more artificial.
The sound you hear initially, should match the sound you hear when playing back the recording (be that recording MIDI or Audio). Not just close, I’m talking, exactly. In theory, you should not be able to distinguish between what you heard when you were playing it versus when you play it back.

It is not clear if you are talking about recording to Cubase or just programming your Performance. But in either case, knowing what you are monitoring and how you assemble your Performance, will be very important.

Sonic differences can occur in several ways:
Monitoring issue: Either you were monitoring yourself improperly during record (a common mistake), or you have isolated Parts to separate audio destinations and are now monitoring them without certain System Effects.

Say you setup to record MIDI data to Cubase. If both pathways are active, that is, Local Control = On and you are echoing back the through a MIDI Track to the Tone Generator, you will hear a double signal. Monitoring like this will give a thicker, swirling type sound — it will sound like a slight chorus effect is being applied — you can understand that this doubling is not being recorded, you are monitoring improperly.

Learn to hear this doubling as an error in monitoring... if you think you like this ‘effect’, then learn how to set it up properly (with an Effect processor assignment, instead of a mistake in monitoring). Remember, as a improper routing situation, it is not being documented/recorded. That is why on playback, when you only hear one of the signal paths — it will sound different from when you originally recorded.

When recording Audio to Cubase, doubling occurs when both the USB Out and the Analog Out are monitored simultaneously— if Direct Monitor is On, the signal goes direct to the Analog Out as normal, but also a digital version goes to the DAW (Cubase) and then Returns to the MONTAGE as audio interface, then to the Analog Out. Double. Choose to Monitor only one during record, because on playback you will hear only the result of one feed.

Alternative
Cubase not involved: you mention something about your Performance being a clone (sorry, I don’t understand what is being said here).

In programming your own Performances, you can do so by “merging” several Performances into one. When doing so there are several things that can change about the selection. When teaching about this concept in audio engineering we talk about how any instrument, alone, sounds one way, but will sound different when placed in an ensemble. It’s a human perception thing...

In the case of the synthesizer, an instrument “Mellow Soprano”, when in a Single Part Performance, has access to 5 Effect processors. Two belong to the instrument sound itself — and should considered apart of the instrument) the other three belong to the over system and recreate the outer environment, the room acoustics.

The two processors that are apart of the instrument sound are called the Insertion Effects. These effects travel with the “Mellow Soprano” Sax sound wherever it goes. When you merge it into a new Performance, it automatically keeps these two processors and the Part Controller Assignments.

The three processors that are not, technically speaking, apart of the instrument are the two System Effects (Reverb, Variation) and the Master Effect. The System Effects work on a SEND/RETURN scenario like you would find on any mixing console — every channel has a Send To these Effect processors, and the Return From these processors gets mixed back to the main stereo flow. Then all signal together goes through the Master Effect (often called “a DJ Effect”... it is putting an effect on a finish product. (When a DJ puts an effect on the signal, it is post (after) everything).

When you move the Mellow Soprano from its Single Part HOME, into another Performance... the Reverb, the Variation and the Master Effect are likely to be different. You can understand this as the Sax joined the band, and is now in a different room together with the band. The acoustics are likely different than when the Sax was at home, now in the rehearsal hall, the acoustics are entirely different.

Part parameters include the (2) Insertion Effects.
Common parameters - there is only one set of Common parameters per Performance. When you “merge” several Parts into the same Performance there can be only one set of room acoustics. Make sense?

You’ll need to give us the details of the Parts you merged to be able to pinpoint what is different.
Because there can be only one set of Common parameters per Performance, all links from the merged Part to the Super Knob will be deactivated. This does not mean they are lost... they are simply deactivated

If you wish to reactivate any of the links to the Common level Assign Knobs and Super Knob, you must review the assignment and reactivate the link. This is necessary because previously the Mellow Soprano was in Part 1 (when at HOME), however, now that it has joined the band, it is likely to be in another Part number. Plus you need to review what may already be assigned to a particular KNOB. There is a maximum of 16 assignments... you must also check to see if you have a Control Assignment available.

Because the upper level programming (like the links to the SuperKnob) is initially stripped off, and may need to be reviewed and reactivated, your newly merged version may sound different in its new HOME.

We don’t have enough information to help you with this specifically. But there are many things that can change when creating your own custom Performances. Understanding what changes is knowable and when you take a close look at the architecture, logical.

If this is your lead instrument - instead of merging it to a different Performance, merge the other instruments into the Mellow Soprano
Instead of the Sax player going to someone’s house, invite the others over to your Sax player’s house (er, HOME).
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Based on Reply #17, I was successful in saving a Performance on the Montage, then transferring it into Cubase with Montage Connect. The new Performance I created was to clone the instruments I had chosen for the original Performance that I had not understood I needed to save. I noticed however, that this time around the Soprano Sax part I had used (I believe it was the Mellow Soprano the first time around), does not sound as authentic as before (and this is the case regardless of whether Cubase is involved or not). In other words, previously, the Soprano Sax Part had a relatively convincing, breathy Sax sound - which we all know is difficult to simulate on a keyboard. Now, however, it sounds more artificial. I'm listening with the same headphones (Yamaha PAC HPH-MT7 Monitoring Headphones) and I am certain the sound of the instrument is different. Rebooting the Montage makes no difference.

I haven't changed any sound settings that I'm aware of - I haven't started to experiment with tweaking Parts (layering, adding effects, etc.), although I want to work on that next. So, I'm wondering:

1) Is there a specific method to recapture the original sound of a Part; and
2) Which processing techniques might help in making Soprano Sax - and other Sax sounds on the Montage, for that matter, more authentic?

Thanks.
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Please see my (now completed) post above #17
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Looks like Jason's tip will enable me to search for and locate performances using the Category Search function filtering by User. But I'm still not sure how to, once it's loaded, transfer it to Cubase via Montage Connect per my question above...
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Thanks for that information. I can see that I successfully stored the Performance I recreated today. I can manage it in the Data Utility, but can't figure how to load it onto the Montage and then to Sync it with Montage Connect to use with my current Cubase Project. Please advise...
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
1) Is there a way to pull up Performances I have created and stored on the Montage that are not stored in the Library? And am I supposed to be storing them in the Library upon creation vs just storing them?
In order to pull up (recall) a Performance that you have created, that Performance must be stored.
This means you must have pressed [STORED] > selected “Create New Performance” or “Overwrite current Performance” — this action will write the data to an internal USER Bank location. Just before it writes the data to the User Bank you are given a chance to name/rename the Performance (highly recommended).

If you do not give your edited data a name, it will be stored with the current name (and you will not be able to identify it as easily because you now have two Performances with the same name).

The MONTAGE can hold as many as 640 User Performances in the internal memory.
You can view the Performances that currently occupy the internal USER memory by pressing [UTILITY] > “Contents” > “Data Utility”
Here you can tap the folder named “Performance” - to review and manage your User Performances.
There are User Bank Folders for your User Arps, your User Live Sets, your User Motion Sequences, your User Waveforms.

Important thing to know: Data in the current User Bank is overwritten when you load the next .X7U File. One User Bank load replaces completely the previous User Bank data. This is why you SAVE a file.
The data in your USER bank can be coverted to a Library File, by setting “Content Type” = save as “Library File” — this action will write a special file type.X7L that can be later loaded into the MONTAGE’s Flash Memory (8 Libraries).

An alternate method to store a Performance is to capture a MIDI Bulk dump using MONTAGE CONNECT (.X7B). But please notice not of all the User data is stored to MONTAGE CONNECT. The MONTAGE CONNECT file assumes the User Arps, User Live Sets, User Motion Sequences, and User Waveforms etc., are already in their respective locations... it restores everything else involving the Performance settings.

You do not have to create a Library until you have enough data to warrant it.
The User Bank is converted into a Library File. It is the .X7L file that includes the instructions on “burning” the data to Flash and the information to create the Search catalog.

This means it can contain as many as
640 Performances
8 User Live Set Banks (256 slots each)
2048 Waveforms
256 Arpeggios
256 Motion Sequences
32 Curves
8 MicroTunings

When data is installed to one of the 8 available Library slots, it will be as permanently accessible as the Factory Preset data.
It cannot be overwritten by Loading a file (exception is the BACKUP File .X7A - which overwrites everything).

2) Since my originally created X7B Performance file seems to have been overwritten in Montage Connect, turning on the Montage, Cubase and Montage now lands me in a one Instrument Performance. How do I either retrieve the originally stored Performance file or, if I start over and recreate the Performance again on the Montage, how do I then get that stored into Montage Connect?
When running MONTAGE CONNECT inside of Cubase, it can capture a bulk of your current Performance which it bundles with the Cubase CPR File.
If you manually overwrite the data with the wrong Performance - you must recreate your Performance.

I (again) highly recommend that you activate “Auto Sync” = On in the lower right corner of the program. This will SAVE and RESTORE your Performance, automatically (removing the possibility of you manually overwriting the data by mistake).

When Auto Sync = On, you do not have to mess with MONTAGE CONNECT... It can run without you messing with it (unless you wish to use one of its other features). When used as a plug-in inside Cubase, Cubase manages the folder to keep your Performances used with a Cubase Project. If/when you run MONTAGE CONNECT as a stand-alone program (without Cubase) you direct the data to any folder yo7 desire on your computer.

3) What should be the ongoing order of turning on or engaging the Montage, Cubase and Montage Connect?
Make all cable connections first.
Turn the MONTAGE On
Power up the computer
Launch Cubase
Finally launch MONTAGE CONNECT
If, as recommended, and you have “Auto Sync” = On when you open a Cubase Project, it will automatically launch MONTAGE CONNECT which will automatically bulk your Performance back to the MONTAGE.

If you are creating a New Project.
Please see the following articles:
MONTAGE CONNECT Default Performance
What is MONTAGE CONNECT
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
1) Is there a way to pull up Performances I have created and stored on the Montage that are not stored in the Library? And am I supposed to be storing them in the Library upon creation vs just storing them?


Press [CATEGORY SEARCH]. You can change the "Bank" filter to "User" which will only show Performances you have [STORE]'d (which always go to the User bank). Filtering in this manner may make things easier - but so would saving your Performances with useful names you can easily find. Say every Performance you create starts with your initials "DCR" (I'm just making this up). Then you could search for "DCR" and only your creations would come up. OR you could mark all of your creations with the "Favorites" option - and then filter by only favorites. This is another way. It's up to you. Most importantly, if you start with a Preset Performance and modify it - don't save it with the default name (which is the same name). Change it to something meaningful/customized/easy to find.

I don't use Connect - so I won't chime in on those.
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Bad Mister,

I do appreciate your reply and continuing guidance. I had tried to add Instruments to the already existing Performance based on the instructions in your Reply #7 above, which I now understand was specific to New Performances only. Your Reply #10 was posted later, and clarified the difference between setting up the Parts of a new vs. already existing Performance. Lesson learned.

I do have a few follow-up questions as I still can't locate the original Performance I had set up in the Montage. Please note that before posting questions here, I typically do searches of the 1000+ page manual, Forum searches, Google searches, YouTube searches, etc. As I said, I appreciate the information available through this Forum, and hope the answers posted might help some other musicians new to Montage/Cubase. Here goes:

1) Is there a way to pull up Performances I have created and stored on the Montage that are not stored in the Library? And am I supposed to be storing them in the Library upon creation vs just storing them?

2) Since my originally created X7B Performance file seems to have been overwritten in Montage Connect, turning on the Montage, Cubase and Montage now lands me in a one Instrument Performance. How do I either retrieve the originally stored Performance file or, if I start over and recreate the Performance again on the Montage, how do I then get that stored into Montage Connect?

3) What should be the ongoing order of turning on or engaging the Montage, Cubase and Montage Connect? Is it A) Plug in USB; B) Turn on Montage; C) Open Montage Connect (either through Cubase or by clicking on the Montage Connect icon on my Taskbar)? D) Click on Load? Is this necessary if I have AutoSave On? And turning off, after saving my Cubase Project, do I have to Save in Montage Connect before closing that program, or do I not have to do that if I AutoSave is on? Or is the order just described incorrect?

Sorry for so many questions, but I'm not yet comprehending the flow. I don't mind doing research or being referred to some reference material so I don't have to ask for so much detail. I would also not mind purchasing online or video courses to learn this stuff faster.

Thanks again.
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
To reiterate: After trying to add (or in this case replace) the Instrument in Slot 7 by selecting that Slot, clicking on Category Search, and selecting Tenor Max, I could not back out to see the whole Performance - either by hitting Performance, the Home icon, etc. Nothing would change, and I could hear no sound even when that Track was selected in Cubase, unless I changed Local Control to On. So, the problem is not yet solved.
Again, these are incorrect steps
After trying to replace the instrument (Single Part) in slot 7 you must press [SHIFT] + [CATEGORY SEARCH].
If you forget to hit [SHIFT] + [CATEGORY SEARCH] you will not launch “Part 7 - Category Search”
What you’ll see instead is “Performance Category Search” — read my post carefully, you missed [SHIFT]

These are two separate routines... one replaces just Part 7.
The other, what you did by just pressing [CATEGORY SEARCH] alone, replaces all 16 Parts with an entirely new (different) Performance. You want to replace just one Part - therefore, it involves the [SHIFT] button. I also offered an alternate method using the screen... and the pop-in menu. (Learn to use both, so you get comfortable navigating).

It seems like when I was selecting a Part within a Performance, the Part selected became the whole Performance. I don't know how I made that happen...
Exactly, what is happening. Learn to read the *name* of each screen — upper left of each and every screen (it tells you where you are). There are three different types of Searches for sounds.
1) Performance Category Search - replaces the entire Performance
2) Performance Merge - adds “+” the new Performance selection to empty Parts of the existing. Initiate by tapping “+”
3) Part Category Search - Select the Part, then [SHIFT] + [CATEGORY SEARCH] to look for a replacement.

You want to use #3 “Part Category Search”, specifically “Part 7 - Category Search”. Once you recognize/understand the three different types of Searches for sounds, you’ll stop having the issue. It is why I explained both Performance Merge and Part Category Search in my post above... you said you added Parts which could be by either “merging” or “replacing” the Part slot #7

Also... if you put “AUTO SYNC” = ON, MONTAGE CONNECT will automatically SAVE your Performance when you SAVE the Cubase Project (watch it happen).

And conversely, it will automatically restore the MONTAGE Performance when you next open this Cubase Project (assuming you are running the MONTAGE CONNECT *inside* of Cubase as a VSTi.
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
I was not feeling well over the weekend, but am feeling better today, so I'm wanting to tackle this problem.

I did check the track settings for Track 7 in Cubase and they are indeed the same as for the other 6 Tracks. Also, I hadn't mentioned earlier that I was setting Attribute to Single all this time, so I've only been using Single Part Instruments - so that is not the cause of the problem.

To reiterate: After trying to add (or in this case replace) the Instrument in Slot 7 by selecting that Slot, clicking on Category Search, and selecting Tenor Max, I could not back out to see the whole Performance - either by hitting Performance, the Home icon, etc. Nothing would change, and I could hear no sound even when that Track was selected in Cubase, unless I changed Local Control to On. So, the problem is not yet solved.

Added twist: I have a tendency to click Save in Montage Connect whenever I am about to exit Cubase; so today, when I turned on the Montage and Cubase, and tried to load the Performance Instruments from Cubase to the Montage by choosing the X7B file name of the previously saved Performance, I noticed in the Performance Name slot: "Tenor Max." So, I'm thinking that I likely hit the Save button in Montage Connect the other day before exiting Cubase when I was stuck in a single Part and Montage Connect overwrote the Performance combination associated with that file with "Tenor Max." I also tried to load an earlier X7B file I had created, and that came up with "Mellow Amp," as the Performance Name - which also brought up "Mellow Amp" on the Montage. That was a keyboard Instrument that had been part of that earlier Performance..... so I'm stuck with Performances that are single Instruments that make no sounds!

It seems like when I was selecting a Part within a Performance, the Part selected became the whole Performance. I don't know how I made that happen...

It's certainly more fun working with the Montage and Cubase when you know what you're doing!
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
See my post above #10 - especially “Important Concept”
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Jason,

Thanks for your response. I'm currently dealing with all MIDI Tracks.

Regarding my inability to get back to viewing the full Performance, when I hit the Performance or Home button, it leaves me in the Part view of the Instrument I've just selected and doesn't take me to the full Performance view - hence my confusion. Maybe I'm missing a step in confirming the selection of the Instrument Part?

Also, I understand that MIDI itself doesn't generate sound but rather sends messages to the keyboard to play the sound. With my other MIDI iInstrument tracks in this Project, as long as I have the Instrument Part coordinated with the appropriate Track in Cubase, I should be able to hear sounds played on the Montage and see a signal in the Track Name pane in Cubase - neither of which is the case with this Instrument/Track, while MIDI Local Off is selected.

Note that when I started on this odd side trip today, I was in the Performance I had created weeks ago in conjunction with Cubase. When I decided to add a 7th Instrument/Track, I selected the 7th Instrument slot of the Performance, then selected Category Search, I noticed that the Instrument I selected produced no sound (sorry if I'm being redundant).

Per your suggestion, I will double check to make sure that that Track is configured like the others.
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
From the Performance view, I selected the 7th Part, clicked on Category Search, chose an instrument, but from there couldn't figure out how to back out to view the full Performance again (other than reloading it from the Cubase project via Montage Connect).
You can always ‘back out’ by pressing the [EXIT] button, or by tapping the ‘Return’ icon (very top line of the screen), or tap the little ‘House’ icon located right next to the Return icon, this HOME icon will take you all the way back to the Performance HOME screen, or press the dedicated [PERFORMANCE (HOME)] screen button.

When you *select* a program item using [Category Search] for Part 7, by the way, there are two different possible ways to do so:
__ 1) use “Performance Merge” — this is launched when Part 7 is empty, ...meaning you tap the “+” symbol to add Part 7. If you ADD a Part this way the Search screen is called “Performance Merge”. It allows you ADD new Performance Parts to the existing Parts, starting at slot 7.
__ 2) use “Part 7 - Category Search” — this is launched when Part 7 is already occupied (either by a Part you previously selected, or when you are replacing a previous instrument in the Multi/GM template)... you are replacing whatever is occupying Part 7. “Part 7 - Category Search” (the screen name, upper left). You need to launch the Part Category Search by [SHIFT] + [CATEGORY SEARCH] or from the HOME screen, tap the Part 7 “Type/Name” box to reveal the pop-in menu, tap the “Category Search” option.

Also, I did not see or hear a signal from that instrument by the track title field in Cubase (unless I turn on Local On), although I could see the signal very bottom right in the Cubase screen. The channel is set correctly in the track in Cubase.
Probably something is missing ... when you properly select the program for Part 7, you did not mention, but you should set the “Bank/Favorite” as you desire, but most importantly, set the “Attribute” = Single.

Important Concept: Setting the “Attrubute” This will turn all search results in the field to green options. Green here signifies a Single Part fully playable instruments — all green sounds shown would be appropriate for use in a Single Part slot. It is possible to miss this (if for example, you selected a blue, MULTI Part, option... not only will it not fit into just Part 7, but it is quite possible it may not sound. REASON: the first Part of the Multi Part program might only cover a specific velocity range, or might only be assigned to a particular region of the keyboard. Say you select a blue option, and Part 1 only sounds at velocities 92-127, or only when you play above G5 on the keyboard... you might think you’ve selected a silent sound. Conclusion: when seeking to fill a Single Part, set Attribute to “Single” - doing this the search results show you only programs that will function as complete instruments from one slot.

You are sending MIDI OUT to Cubase, because you have *selected* MONTAGE Part 7. Signal is arriving in Cubase.
You are not hearing the sound because you must *select* a MIDI Track in Cubase - The Track must be set to receive MIDI from the MONTAGE (Port 1),
It must be set to transmit Out to the MONTAGE (Port 1) , and the Out channel should be “7”
When working with Single Part instruments, there is no need to have any of the KBD CTRL icons active... you activate a MONTAGE single Part by simply selecting it.
You activate a Cubase MIDI Track by highlighting/selecting it.

This completes the routing circuit back to the MONTAGE Tone Generator. (But only when that MIDI Track is actively selected).
“Local Control” = Off disconnects the MONTAGE Keyboard from the MONTAGE Tone Generator.
You are literally placing the MIDI Track between the Keyboard and the Tone Generator.

Extra Credit: — Add and record a Multi Part program
Say you wanted to ADD a 2-Part instrument sound. It would need to occupy Parts 7 and 8.
You would tap the “+” in empty Part 7
This would launch the “Performance Merge” search engine
Set “Bank/Favorite” = All
Set “Attribute” = All (you will now see blue, Multi Part, and green, Single Part, options.
Tap “Main”
Set as “SynLead”

For this example, let’s say you wanted to add the Synth Lead sound called “Singleline 2” (a 2-Part AWM2+FM-X synth lead)
Adding this will place programs in both slots 7 and 8
Here, in order to play both Parts simultaneously you must return to the HOME screen
Ensure the KBD CTRL icons are active (green) for both Parts 7 and 8

In Cubase, select two Tracks set to Out data on Channels 7 and 8 respectively.
Because the Input Transformers are in play... data arriving from the MONTAGE on Ch7 will only be recorded to the MIDI Track set to Channel 7, and data arriving on Ch8 will be recorded by the MIDI Track set to Channel 8.

You can select two tracks in Cubase... and play the

Hope that helps.
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Press [PERFORMANCE] (HOME) to see the the "full" Performance. It's to the right of the touch screen along the top row of buttons.

Or you can press the "home" icon in the upper-left corner of the touchscreen.

Also, I did not see or hear a signal from that instrument by the track title field in Cubase (unless I turn on Local On)


If this is a MIDI track - then you don't hear MIDI. MIDI can tell Montage to make noise - but the MIDI track itself isn't audio and cannot be heard. It's not clear the type of track exactly - and it's not altogether too important rather I'm just covering a reminder that it's important to be precise (or as precise as your current skill level allows).

If you need to turn local control on in order to hear anything for Part 7 - then it seems the Cubase track handling this MIDI channel may be configured unlike the others. Make sure, in Cubase, the MIDI output of this track is going back to Montage and set to channel "ANY" - which ensures that the outgoing MIDI channel will match the incoming channel.

Just in case: zone master should be turned off for this as initial Cubase learning doesn't need to deal with zones.
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
So I've been working on getting comfortable with the coordination between the Montage and Cubase over the past month using Montage Connect. I configured 6 single-part instruments within a Performance and have been recording, editing using the various Cubase editors, punching in and out, copying and pasting, muting, soloing, etc. i figured I was ready to ask about adding multiple-part instruments.... but first, I decided to add another few single-part instruments first, and hit a minor roadblock: From the Performance view, I selected the 7th Part, clicked on Category Search, chose an instrument, but from there couldn't figure out how to back out to view the full Performance again (other than reloading it from the Cubase project via Montage Connect). Also, I did not see or hear a signal from that instrument by the track title field in Cubase (unless I turn on Local On), although I could see the signal very bottom right in the Cubase screen. The channel is set correctly in the track in Cubase. Predictably, when I reload the Performance from Cubase, the new instrument is not showing - so I'm sure I'm doing something incorrectly.

Please advise.... Thanks.
Bad Mister
Yamaha
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Update: So, I've been working on getting acquainted with both the Montage 8 and Cubase. Happy to say I was able to set up a keyboard instrument in Cubase per the instructions above (I think) and record something in a Midi Track on Channel 1, so that's pretty exciting...:p
it is perhaps wise to pause here (in the learning of Cubase Pro) to learn how your instrument, the MONTAGE.
The Performance is the main structure in the MONTAGE architecture - there will one Performance per Cubase Pro Project.

A Performance can have 16 Parts.
A Part can be a musical instrument. But know that MONTAGE also can have MULTI Part instruments*
You can “merge” 16 Parts into your one Performance.

*The MONTAGE does allow you to program an instrument using multiple Parts.
I highly recommend — while learning to use this setup — to begin with SINGLE Part instruments. What this means is set your selection option to limit you to recording one MONTAGE Part to each Cubase MIDI Track... starting with “MIDI 01” and continuing toward “MIDI 16”.

And once you are comfortable with the logistics of this operation, then and only then proceed to adding Multi Part instruments to your recordings setup skills. I ask you to trust me on this, jumping in and behaving like you know what your doing will cause to rely on memories of your old synthesizers and how “you used to work” — instead of learning the system and perhaps, new opportunities that are bound to come about when using this new system!

Why Single Part recording, initially?
Mainly because the workflow is familiar and similar to what you may be previously used to... this will get you to a certain ‘comfort zone’. And when you do move to more complex recording setups, you will be able to appreciate why certain setting must change. When playing Multi Part instruments, your workflow may need to change depending on how your multiple Parts are interacting - remember there are some new things possible between multiple Part instrument sounds are are NEW and DIFFERENT from any synth you may have previously encountered or attempted to record — and it will be better understood after conquering the straight “One Part to One Track on One Channel” recording methodology.

Initial MONTAGE setup
From HOME
Press [CATEGORY SEARCH]
Set “Bank/Favorite” = All
Set “Attribute” = All
Select “Init”
Select “Multi/GM”

This places a “placeholder” instrument in each Part, 1-16 which you will replace, one-by-one.
Notice the initial setup has KBD CTL set to Part 1 (alone)
I recommend activating the KBD CTRL LOCK = ON — this will allow an individual Part to play only when you select it, directly. When you want to interact with Part 2, simply select Part 2, only Part 2 will sound.

Touch “FX” at the very top center of the screen - this is a shortcut to the Utility screen where you can bypass effects, and set the condition for the KBD CTRL LOCK.
Set the KBD CTRL LOCK = On

Press [EXIT] to return to your work.

Using the “Part Category Search”
You will create a New Performance by *replacing* each Part, one after the other.
We want to limit our search to the hundreds of Single Part (green) listings in the Search engine.
__ Select a Part
__ If you tap the “Type/Name” box in the screen by Part 1, a pop-in menu will appear, you can tap “Category Search” to launch “Part 1 - Category Search”.
__ Set the “Bank/Favorite” = All, Set the “Attribute” = Single
This will refine the Search to just those programs that are full instruments and occupy a single Performance slot. Making a selection will *replace* the placeholder “Concert GrandPiano” with your selection.
Select Part 2 and make a selection, and so on...

Alternate method: Button Method
__ Select Part 1 using the right front panel button [PART SELECT 1]
__ Press the [SHIFT] + [CATEGORY SEARCH] buttons to launch the “Part 1 Category Search”
__ Set the “Bank/Favorite” = All, Set the “Attribute” = Single


With this setup you will be able to move from Part to Part adding a new instrument to each Part.
You can set LOCAL CONTROL on the MONTAGE = OFF (If you select the MONTAGE “Quick Setup #1” — “MIDI Rec On DAW” this will set Local Control =Off... Here you use Cubase Pro to determine what you a hearing...

When LOCAL CONTROL is OFF, you will hear and be able to communicate with a MONTAGE PART by selecting it on the MONTAGE and activating (selecting) the corresponding MIDI Track in Cubase... remember: it is the MIDI CH number that is important!

Select Part 1 (using your favorite method) on the MONTAGE.
Highlight MIDI 01 Track in Cubase Pro... you should now be able to play and hear the instrument you selected for Part 1

Record several tracks — the Part number will correspond with the default name Cubase gives the MIDI Track.
Get used to the basic stuff, looking at the various Edit screens - the KEY EDITOR, the LIST EDITOR, the SCORE, get used to setting playback functions, Cycling, resizing, etc., etc., etc. take your time — get comfortable. Test yourself by challenging yourself.

Practice things like punching in and out, copying and pasting, basic editing. Once you are comfortable with Muting, soloing, punching in and basic editing, then see if you can start to transfer some of the edited Parts to Audio Tracks... the idea is to master the workflow from MIDI to Editing to Rendering Audio... before diving in the deeper end of the pool.

Let us know.
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE Series Synthesizers
  3. # 18
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Update: So, I've been working on getting acquainted with both the Montage 8 and Cubase. Happy to say I was able to set up a keyboard instrument in Cubase per the instructions above (I think) and record something in a Midi Track on Channel 1, so that's pretty exciting...:p

However, when I then went to set up a bass track on Channel 2, by setting up a performance on the Montage and then selecting the second midi track, I could not arm that track to record the bass performance I set up in the Montage (no sound and no signal shows to the right of the orange/white title bar that says "Montage Bass";). Note that I had configured the first midi track - at Track 3 - (Midi 01 before I renamed it) using channel 1. I'd set up the second midi track (It says "4" on the left) using channel 2.

When I go back and highlight the Montage Keys track, but with the Montage bass performance selected on the Montage, and I play the recording previously made on the Keys track, it is now using the bass performance for the Keys sound.

When I had previously used Cakewalk with a Korg Krome keyboard, I would configure the instrument to be used in the internal sequencer of the keyboard as well as in Cakewalk, and Cakewalk would consequently know which track/channel/instrument to trigger.

I'm sure I'm missing some steps here, so would appreciate being informed about what additional steps I need to take to record properly on multiple tracks with multiple "instruments."

[Note I tried to attach a screen shot of my Cubase project to this post as I'm sure it would be helpful in pinpointing steps I'm missing. However, neither Word or pdf docs appear to be supported by the forum. I also tried to paste a screenshot to the post but that didn't work either. if someone can tell me how to provide the screenshot, I can add that.]


As an aside, I had followed instructions on a Sweetwater web page (since I purchased the Montage from SW) on setting up a Montage-DAW connection:

Setting up your DAW

After you have installed the Yamaha Steinberg driver and connected it to your computer, you first need to configure the Montage, so it communicates properly with your DAW. You will need to change the MIDI I/O settings. If you plan on using the Montage with external audio gear, you will also need to configure the Audio I/O settings, as well. Follow these steps to configure your Montage.

1. Connect the Montage to your computer, press the Utility button, and select Settings.
2. Select the MIDI I/O option and change the following settings:
MIDI IN/OUT: USB
Local Control: OFF
3. Select the Advanced tab and change the MIDI I/O Mode to Multi. This allows all Parts of your Performance to have its own MIDI channel.
The Part number of the Performance is assigned to that MIDI channel number. For example, Part number 1 is MIDI channel 1; Part number 2 is assigned to channel 2, etc. These MIDI channels cannot be changed.
4. Go to the Performance screen and turn off KbdCtrl for each Part. If this is left on, it will play all the Parts that are in that performance.

However, that last instruction - 4. (bolded above) was confusing. I didn't know if it was referring to GLOBALLY turning off KbdCtrl for each part, or individually by performance, which didn't seem to make sense. I couldn't find a place to turn off KbdCtrl for all performances, so I did a chat with Yamaha Montage Tech Support on Friday and the gentleman assisting me didn't know either....

Also, the Sweetwater Montage setup page featured the BadMister Mastering MONTAGE: Cubase Setup videos, and I had thought I could learn some things there, but it appears those were based on the AI version on Cubase, since the menu options are different from those in Cubase 11 Pro, and I couldn't correlate the information for my version of Cubase. I'd like to see a comparable set of videos for Cubase 11 Pro, if it exists and is appropriate.

I'll appreciate any assistance in setting up Cubase properly to record the Montage.

Thanks,

David
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE Series Synthesizers
  3. # 19
Accepted Answer Pending Moderation
Bad Mister,

Thanks for the very detailed information. I will try to digest and apply.

Regards,

David
  1. more than a month ago
  2. MONTAGE Series Synthesizers
  3. # 20
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