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ASSIGN EFFECT SWELL (FOR BRASS) TO SUPERKNOB

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I've been browsing the forum, and I have not found an answer to this. I have started reading the "MASTERING MODX: Superknob ..." and they are fantastically deep and detailed to read carefully and learn in depth about the subject, but for the question itself I need to know at this moment, it's like "search a needle in a haystack "and I do not even know if I could identify inside of them what I need since the" swell effect "I do not know from where it is assigned.
My specific question is: to assign (in a multi-part PERFORMANCE) the swell effect to a specific part with the sound of "Big Band" to control it through the superknob.

It is a PERFORMANCE made by me, in which the superknob does not affect any of the parties at this time.

Thanks in advance!!

 
Posted : 23/01/2019 11:00 am
Jason
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"Swell effect" isn't, technically, the name of a parameter. "Volume" (or "Level" ) is closer to the name of a parameter. Is that what you want? Superknob to control the volume so you can turn it one way to crescendo then the other to decrescendo?

Or is there a button/knob that currently does what you want - and you just want to move the control over to superknob? If so, what's the current button/knob that does what you want?

If you wanted superknob to control the volume of the "Big Band" part - you would:

1) Ensure you're in the "HOME" screen (place that shows Performance name and all Parts)
2) Touch the lower-right of the "Big Band" PART. This is an area that shows the volume of the PART.
3) Notice the [CONTROL ASSIGN] button illuminates if it was not lit before. Press the [CONTROL ASSIGN] button
4) Move superknob enough for MODX to bring you to a new menu
5) Change polarity to bi-polar. By default the setup is to only ADD to the current volume. Bi-Polar changes this to both add and subtract. Superknob at 12 o'clock keeps volume the same. Counter clockwise from here is reducing volume and clockwise from here is increasing volume.

You would likely want to store the Performance with superknob set to 12 o'clock.

 
Posted : 23/01/2019 7:02 pm
Bad Mister
Posts: 12304
 

I haven’t translated this article for MODX... But reading through this article on the MONTAGE should give the details on how this unique Element morphing accomplishes the change... in most sample-based units you use Velocity to change the active Waveform... but that means having to re-strike the key... Motion Control via the Super Knob does the magic for you... and allows you to “Swell” with the unique harmonic content variation you should expect. The article should be translatable... all edit page screenshots are identical.

Use a Yamaha FC7 to do the Element morphing (Swell) with your foot:

Orchestra Brass Swell

Sorry, the links to the .wav Files seem to have disappeared but they were recordings of the Audition Phrases, so just press your [AUDITION] button to hear them.

 
Posted : 23/01/2019 8:16 pm
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Thank you for your answers!

Jason, I understand what you say about the "volume" or "level" parameter, but I think it's not really that effect on the sound that I'm looking for exactly. I have already verified your explanation and it's great for me to be able to apply it in many other cases, but in this specific case, I'm looking for something more specific. Let's say it simultaneously affects the volume, but it also affects the timbre. (from dark to bright and vice versa). It is very well explained in the article that Bad Mister has contributed.

Thanks Bad Mister for the contribution!

Ideally, I would be able to apply this effect explained in the article "ORCHESTRA BRASS SWELL" but with the simplicity and practicality of Jason's explanation.

Maybe I'm asking for an impossible, I do not know. Once again, excuse my awkwardness!

Very thankful!

 
Posted : 24/01/2019 1:30 am
Jason
Posts: 7907
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Now we have something - the Orchestra swell tutorial is really just 4 pictures and very minimal text.

Big Band's first 3 elements are the ones you want to "morph" between. You can probably ignore Elements 4 and 5 altogether. Particularly if your version discards the low brass sound.

You would go into "Mod/Control" -> "Control Assign", press the [+] under destinations, pick "Element" > "Level" as your destination - then copy the 2nd picture in the tutorial to match. Element 1 is the correct one to control, just like the picture. Add another Element Level destination (by pressing [+] again) and choose element 2. Copy the parameters in the 3nd picture. And then again for a 3rd Element Level and copy the 5th picture (except instead of elements shown, use element 3). Note - since we have 3 regions and Orchestra Swell has 4 - you'll have to adjust some of the parameters so there is not a gap between element 2 and element 3.

You'll also want to change the velocity limit in each element 1-3 so that the low range is 1 and high range is 127. This is because we no longer want velocity to be switching if the element sounds or not

The orchestra swell tutorial isn't that long. About 6 paragraphs of background/rationale and nuts and bolts are just a few blurbs and 4 pictures at end.

One nuance that is not spelled out - is that for this to work, your Big Band PART needs to match the programmed element levels. "Big Band" has its element levels set to non-zero. This doesn't work when you're trying to control like the Orch Swell Performance. What you need to do is go into each element 1-3 of "Big Band" and change the element level (programmed) to 0. You touch Element 1, then pick the "Amplitude" -> "Level/Pan" menu, then select the "Level" parameter and change it to 0. Repeat for elements 2 and 3.

There are lots of existing other swell Performances you can look at and see what they did. You may be able to borrow ideas from other performances with 3 "things" morphed. Or add a "between" dynamic borrowed from another brass sample like what the pop horn swell does.

 
Posted : 24/01/2019 5:43 am
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It is enormously frustrating to see the help in the palm of your hand and not even know how to take advantage of it. I think I have done everything as it is explained step by step and I have not achieved anything. In the images it appears in the tab "display filter" Asgnknob5 and to be able to listen to the effect, it is the knob that I have moved and I have not heard any result after the whole process and moving superknob either. Then I repeated the entire process step by step but selecting "Superknob" in the "Display Filter" tab and neither.

I have taken into account this: "you will have to adjust some of the parameters so there is no gap between element 2 and element 3." and although I have not modified anything about it ... but I did not notice any effect!

Thanks also for trying to help me!

 
Posted : 24/01/2019 9:27 am
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It works now. Now it is only necessary to adjust the parameters a bit so that the effect is exact.

I think the problem was the following. I had done the superknob volume control setup since yesterday when I tried the first option that Jason told me, and maybe this was causing conflict. I eliminated the Big Band part of the Performance and re-added it from scratch. Now everything is great.

Thanks for your invaluable help!

 
Posted : 24/01/2019 10:10 am
Jason
Posts: 7907
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Checking a few things:

1) For “Element Level” as the destination, there will be a list of element numbers 1-8 you can toggle on and off. Does the first of these “Element Level” destinations show only element 1 selected? Second (“Element Level” destination) show only element 2 selected? And third only show element 3 selected?

2) Did you modify the levels of elements 1-5 (all for this PART) to 0?

3) Is polarity uni-polar on all curves with “Element Level” as the destination?

4) What is the source shown for these “Element Level” as destination?
Note: to “cheat” - you may want to start with training wheels first and use the mod wheel as your source. Mod wheel as the source would take away any problems of the superknob-to-assignable knob assignments and also take away any chance of thinking you’re turning the correct assignable knob when really the knobs are in a different mode (not PART assignable). Then you would move the mod wheel to hear the morphing. If it’s working, you can edit to make superknob control this in steps. Assign all “Element Level” destinations to the source of an appropriate assignable knob - then, in the Common/Audio section, assign a common-level (Performance global) assignable knob to the correct PART’s (the one with “Big Band”) assignable knob which is tied to these 3 destinations.

Different ways to establish these super knob associations to PART destinations should be detailed in the various tutorials available. This is not something which is expected to be an overnight study.

The fact that despite your best efforts - things are not working correctly - is not considered failure. This is learning. You’ll get there.

 
Posted : 24/01/2019 10:28 am
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Yes, Jason, all the parameters were correct. I started from scratch and everything worked. It has not been necessary to check with the modulation wheel.
Thank you!

 
Posted : 24/01/2019 11:01 am
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