Yes, the sustain pedal cc064 (Hold 1) will hold the Amplitude Envelope at its current level. A percussive sound (like piano) has Decay 2 Level = 0... By definition a percussive sound will fade to 0. A string or pad sound will sustain forever, because Decay 2 Level is NOT 0, so as long as you hold the sustain pedal, that's how long it sustains. If you lift and re-engage the sustain pedal you will grab and hold the sound at whatever level it has decayed to. This is completely normal behavior.

Thanks for the reply
Maybe it is normal on the cp4. With other stage piano this problem don't happen.
I tried the cp4 as master with vst pad and it is all ok.
With the internal sound sustain behaves differently.
I do not know..... 🙁

I do, and I explained. It is not a problem but a specific behavior of the AEG. Percussion instruments behave differently from instruments that are self-oscillating. Percussion instrument naturally fade to zero output no matter you are holding the keys. Self-oscillating instruments sustain as long as you hold the keys.

Please adjust the DECAY and RELEASE parameter in the EG
Press EDIT > select PART > select PLAY MODE > find FILTER/EG > adjust the DECAY and RELEASE parameters for the pad sound to adjust its behavior. It's programmable! 🙂

Bad Mister wrote:

I do, and I explained. It is not a problem but a specific behavior of the AEG. Percussion instruments behave differently from instruments that are self-oscillating. Percussion instrument naturally fade to zero output no matter you are holding the keys. Self-oscillating instruments sustain as long as you hold the keys.

Please adjust the DECAY and RELEASE parameter in the EG
Press EDIT > select PART > select PLAY MODE > find FILTER/EG > adjust the DECAY and RELEASE parameters for the pad sound to adjust its behavior. It's programmable! 🙂

I think what the original poster was asking was something like this.....

(btw, I personally have had a yamaha p120, and briefly owned a p255, and the behavior with pads and strings is similar to what is described below)

When a string patch was layered with the piano (maybe even the string patch on it's own..), it behaved differently with pedaling vs non pedaling.

WITHOUT any sustain pedaling:

play a chord, release notes...sound stops
hold a chord, it sustains indefinitely until you release the keys

WITH sustain pedal:
depress sustain pedal, and play a chord...whether you have a string or pad selected, the sound softly decays on it's own to not get clustered with continuous sustaining on top of a piano sound (this was the behavior of the p120 and p255)

I understand what you are suggesting, but is there anyway to repeat the above behavior? It's sustain pedal specific, not just the ADSR behavior of the pad/string layer

Yes, on Yamaha keyboards that are not synthesizers (or are not designed in the synthesizer department) the behavior is slightly different on this point - For example, the P-series pianos, with no ability to adjust Envelopes, the envelopes are "Forced" to behave as the piano behaves. The P in P-series is for Principally Piano (no MW or PB Wheel, etc, etc)

In the real world Strings and Brass do not have sustain pedals. So there is no real expectation as to how it should work on those sounds (other than having grown up on an instrument that has one - piano players think the world is full of instrument with sustain functions). That is not the case. The pianos relationship with its sustain function is rather unique in the world of acoustic instruments (and it is wrongly named at that) 🙂

When you have sampled instrument in the category of "self-oscillating instruments" (instruments that can indefinitely sound because how how they are triggered) you have the necessary evil of looped waveforms. This allows the player to hold a key, and have the sound remain at the held volume, for whatever length necessary and the sound continues. You need this to do eight tied whole notes on-demand. On string instrument this is handled by reversing the direction of the bow, on brass family instrument this is handled by circular breathing.

Bowing and blowing can continue indefinitely, absolutely indefinitely! means forever, as long as the player applies pressure the sound continues. On percussion instrument that is not the case... the sustain pedal on an acoustic piano itself is mis-named - it is actually the "stave-off-disappearing-completely-for-a-little-longer-pedal" - it is not, technically speaking, a sustain pedal.

When you sample a percussion instrument (of which piano is one, a unique one but a percussion instrument nonetheless), the envelopes will decay to nothing, no matter what you do. You can only delay the inevitable as percussion instruments are hammered, struck or plucked. And the energy of that triggered attack ultimately dies away due to gravity, friction, etc.

The piano sustain pedal delays the inevitable by keeping the dampers off of the strings that have been struck and are ringing - but they, too, are slowly fading away, as the energy is lost to friction with the air. In the synthesizer the sustain pedal "holds" the level of the amplitude envelope generator (AEG) at the Level it has reached in the sound's envelope. If the sound remains at a specific level while held, the pedal will latch it at that level). If the final Decay Level is 0 the sound will die out at Time set for that segment.

So on the P-series because you do not have the ability to edit much of anything as deep as an AEG, rather than explain to pianist that strings don't really "behave" like a piano, they just go ahead and make it 'behave' like a piano. But what is going on in the background in the P-series is really just making everything piano-centric. It is FORCED into that behavior.

Strings when played alone need to be able to hold notes for as long as necessary, without decaying, without behaving like a piano. On the more advanced (synth type) products you get to program what happens for how you want to use the instrument.

We say there is good news and bad news: The good news is your Yamaha advanced keyboard is programmable, the bad news is (depending on where you sit) you'll need to program it!

If you want the Strings to behave like a piano, you can edit your strings to do so
If you want the Strings to behave like strings, you can edit your string to do so
The point is on the CP-series, you can program the envelope - I guess the point is... program it and STORE the results.

Hope that helps.