Maybe check your speakers and the audio output path first. Also, just to be sure, make sure A/D INPUT is turned off so there's no "interference" with that part of the audio path that could be contributing.

I didn't see any changes in the firmware release notes that would affect FM-X parameters. You should be hearing this issue across the board since, once converted, the DX7 patches aren't any different than the preset FM-X only performances in terms of settings and how they work. So I would suspect that all your performances share the same behavior if the issue may be with your audio output path (including cables, speakers, external mixers, external amps, etc).

I do understand that the firmware update seems to be the critical change - but there could be a different either coincidental (something happened to "go out") or intentional (you were doing something else to change the config around the same time as firmware update) difference which is causing the issue.

It's usually best to sort these things out first - since you will run into a checklist of more basic items first unless you have those covered.

thanks jason, after a later restart of montage the converted patches came back to live. may be it was link with the experiment of vocoder modulation by part to fmx factory part?
but only the converted ones were affected ?
ghost in the machine...

If you had a performance where you were experimenting with the Vocoder and were using that same performance to "bring in" FM-X voices which happened to be the DX7 converted ones - then it's more likely you were hearing the effect output and not the FM-X true output.

Another way to have isolated this was to turn all effects off (Master, Insertion, etc). This kind of brings me back to my missing the physical effects on/off buttons because I would sometimes run into a similar scenario and pressing a button to turn off effects was a quick fix. You can still menu dive - but there were just some venues that had a very wet signal that would not work well with effects turned on - so it was good to have a quick one-button "hammer". Even better when the worst of the, then "Voices", would only come into play in the middle of the song and I was able to quickly press "the panic button" (effects OFF).

I'm fairly convinced this is the case of connecting the wrong dots - and the Firmware upgrade is fine. You can, at will, recreate the vocoder scenario if you follow your same steps to set that up as you used before - but then change the settings (like effects on/off) to help give you confidence in both the lack of random-ness of the behavior, and also that there is otherwise nothing mysterious going on.

thanks jason, after a later restart of montage the converted patches came back to live. may be it was link with the experiment of vocoder modulation by part to fmx factory part?
but only the converted ones were affected ?
ghost in the machine...

No bug.

To bypass Effects: touch "FX" at the top of the screen
Bypasses exist for Insert Effects, System Effects, Master Effects, ARPs

thanks for your help, but i can say indeed it was a bug. why, ?

because, after have rebooted the montage the first time, all converted patches,
witch were in user memory had still this volume shut down 90 %. my montage start with
the original factory piano preset.
even after loading them again from usb key to librairy
the issue was not solved.
it is few hours after, after a power on and a long play on montage, i did not try during this cession the converted fm,
thinking no way but just before power off the montage i had a try again and all converted came back
to life. for me it is a bug type ghost in the machine.;)

Maybe so - although there are some other possibilities. If that happened to me, I'd try to reproduce the steps that led to the issue including any other experimentation that was happening around the same time. If you were doing vocoder experimentation during the same power cycle just past the firmware update, then be sure to include the same type of steps from a power-on (not a need to reflash the firmware) - but "pretend" you had flashed and retrace your steps. The key here is a set of repeatable steps that can land you into the unexpected behavior.

Or ... you can keep an eye out for something similar and continue to use the keyboard now that it seems to be working properly for you.

Not saying you certainly do not have a bug, just that something that cannot be reproduced (now it seems to be working) makes it a tough call to earn that label.

the bug is still there, damned . in fact it concern the headphone audio, not the main out. the detail
is that i was using headphone during the experiment and then, later i was using the main out during my cession play.
i thought it was solved but not, i still have this issue on converted fm, it does not concern the fmx factory that have normal behavior volume
not 90% down like the 64 converted[ that were working perfectly before]. and i cannot say about the origine, not sure it come from vocoder part to part modulating as i maybe not try headphone for hearing
the converted fm after the upload os 1.204. not sure. but issue is here, in the headphone output.

If you can find any converted FM sounds that do not have this level issue - then it may also point towards to an issue with the source patch at a low level itself. Maybe if you shared the worst of your converted DX sounds' X7B file - then it could be confirmed on another Montage what the behavior is.

Myself, I still have an older version installed - so I could test that theory. I do not think the firmware version will make any difference, but it's something I am sure you may be interested in having tested.

If it's the original source's issue - then I'll hear a low level and would go to the carrier levels in the FM-X operator to bump it up.

I've also seen you mention "scratchy" which is part of why I suggested checking the cables and so forth.

You could also try using the Assign L&R instead of Main L&R to help test if it's an amp or port issue. Or even use USB Out L&R and PC-connected speakers for yet another signal path.

I'm just advocating going down a list of other possibilities and ruling out as much as possible.

-''If you can find any converted FM sounds that do not have this level issue >>>>''

all the bank is concerned.

-''I've also seen you mention "scratchy" which is part of why I suggested checking the cables and so forth.''

it concern only the converted fm

-''You could also try using the Assign L&R instead of Main L&R to help test if it's an amp or port issue. Or even use USB Out L&R and PC-connected speakers for yet another signal path. ''

i will try it. thanks

Was mainly suggesting to find the worst offender - a converted "patch" that sounds just plain silly wrong and export that to a X7B. Also would help to post the original (pre conversion) file. The other consideration is if the source "patch" is public domain or not. So this would be probably the first question to settle before posting.

What the X7B does is a bulk-dump of your performance edit buffer - so this will be an exact copy of your "broken" settings that you are hearing the moment before you save the X7B. As long as the issue is occurring, save the X7B without (before saving the X7B) changing performances or doing any other edits/changes.

To double check, when you pull up a preset (like piano) - and I imagine no longer hear the low/scratchy audio - load the X7B and see if immediately the problem comes back.

I'm not sure I've learned if other FM presets (not the converted ones) share the same behavior. Something like "DX FM EP" or "FM Wr 2".

Also, not sure I learned if anything changes when you turn all the effects off. Insertion/System/Master.

If there's a bug - maybe all the converted patches now have some effect turned on that wasn't turned on before - so going through the steps of turning off effects helps narrow that down.

But your latest update is interesting - so Main L&R sounds fine - but headphones don't? Of course this then brings up checking the headphones, any adapter you may be using. Use a different pair - different adapter - all that. Maybe the output level is too high. Maybe you have a battery in something along the chain. Maybe they're wireless and otherwise suffering from interference. These would be the first types of things. Maybe already done.

-''checking the headphones,''

factory fm sound normal in headphone....

-''Also, not sure I learned if anything changes when you turn all the effects off. Insertion/System/Master''
the converted dont have any effect, they are just dx7 original patches i made 30 years ago, i did not modify them at all
so when you disable all effect, nothing change as there is no effect assignation.

i have to load another converted dx7 from net and see if same problem occur, but i am quite sure it will occur.

here the converted banks

-''checking the headphones,''

factory fm sound normal in headphone....

-''Also, not sure I learned if anything changes when you turn all the effects off. Insertion/System/Master''
the converted dont have any effect, they are just dx7 original patches i made 30 years ago, i did not modify them at all
so when you disable all effect, nothing change as there is no effect assignation.

i have to load another converted dx7 from net and see if same problem occur, but i am quite sure it will occur.

here the converted banks

Hi Natalini,

just loaded the sounds into my Montage with firmware version 1.20. They sound just fine. No problem at all with some neither over the headphones nor over the normal outs. They are certainly loud - even loader than the factory sounds for me. Especially there is no difference between the headphone output perceived loudness and that over the amplifier. Actually for example the sound is so loud that it goes into distortion. I had to lower the sound of the performance to get rid of that.

Nice sounds btw. But also they are nice examples for the difference between a DX-7 and the Montage capabilities: I played around a bit with the Oberheim sound. I added a bit of reverb, a bit of chorus and a skirt to operator 3 and 4 which is controllable by the super-knob. Suddenly it is no longer "kind of nice" but a really great sound.

Stevie

it should be not a firmware issue but my montage have an issue for sure. i dont use so much headphone so
i will see further but i dont see how it could be an hardware problem.?? i will load a different dx7 bank for check.

A few montage touches can improve dramatically the sound .:)

THE CONVERTED BANK I POSTED WAS NOT MINE i mistake banks but anyway i loaded it in my montage and i
have same trouble with headphone. this is really headache as it concern only the headphone and only fm converted.
is there a yamaha team who have idea what is going on ? how can montage architecture involved on that ? it seems completely mysterious and illogical