Your observations describe normal operation. You're not missing much here. When you describe trying to "save" the [ASSIGN 1] button - this is where I see some chance for learning.

First, I'll cover your second attempt - to save [ASSIGN 1] in a scene. If you look at the "Scene" menu and tab through the various categories - you'll notice that there is nothing shown for saving the [ASSIGN 1] or [ASSIGN 2] buttons. For the most part, scenes do not save controllers. The only exception is the super knob. This is the only controller saved by scenes - you can set superknob to any position for each scene. Keep in mind that scene memory stores a very limited amount of settings.

As for the assignable switches themselves - what you're dealing with is the reset condition of controllers. If you look at the reset condition for controllers (reference manual) you will see both assignable switches default to OFF. ( https://usa.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/9/812529/montage_en_rm_a0.pdf page 170).

Normally when you switch Performances - all of the controllers are reset. The only way you can change this is to change a system setting under [UTILITY]. "Settings" -> "MIDI I/O" and set the "Controller Reset" setting. If you change this from the default of "Reset" to "Hold" - then the controllers normally reset will keep the state before changing Performances. Although this is different behavior - it's often not really what you want either. Ideally - you want to set the reset condition to what you want - on on or off. At least that's your reasoning thus far. That's understandable - but not an option.

I would instead work with the system and leave the controllers set to Reset as default. Then you know [ASSIGN 1] and [ASSIGN 2] will be set to off. Given this, reconfigure your Performance to use this in order to realize the functionality you're looking for. Change the "logic" (controller assignment curves) such that when the assignable switch is OFF - this sets the parameter to "poly" and when the assignable switch is ON - make this set the parameter to "mono".

That's most of the rundown. The only other extra I'd say is that assignable switches 1&2 can be set and cleared by controller arpeggios. Arpeggios do not automatically run when you switch Performances (you have to trigger them first). But knowing you can switch the assignable switches on/off with controller ARPs may give you an opportunity for different options. Because even though the button will default as off - maybe a non-looping control arpeggio that sets the switch to ON could be used on your first keypress. There are different opportunities for automation using arpeggios (and arp note limits) that go beyond anything you're trying to do. I personally wouldn't use an ARP just to try to get the button to light up and be "on" during the first note played. It's much cleaner to work with the off state and reconfigure the "logic" to fit that reset condition.

I've mapped "Assign 1" to a preset's such that when it's fully lit, it's in "Poly" and when it's dim it's in "Mono".

But I wanted to save the preset such that when I load it, it is on "Poly" by default.

The problem is no matter what I do I can't seem to save the "on" value of the "Assign 1" button (the "switch", not the knob) -- when it loads the preset, the button is always "off". Likewise it does not remember its value from scene to scene -- changing scenes just keeps the switch value at whatever it currently is.

What am I missing?

Thanks,

Z

Please see the following thread: Assign Switches _ Controller Rest

And yet the Arpeggio's state is saveable, in Scenes, Parts and Performances.

Can you two at least see why a user might expect that Assignable Switches have a saveable state other than their default?

I know this is the implied wish. I don't discourage requesting things that don't exist. At present if you want an assignable switch to change the state of a parameter you have to work with how the system functions now.

The question was what is being missed in relating to the hardware as it stands- not necessarily that the state of LED was a must have. That would be a valid follow-up if the opposite LED state is a non-starter.

Here's a link to my own wish/suggestion for allowing for setting the assignable switch states: https://www.yamahasynth.com/forum/scene-variations-with-pattern-sequencer#reply-94520

Wish or not - the priority is to learn the system capabilities and limitations because this is the shortest path to realizing something that works sonically and in response to the controllers. I've wished for the same thing and there are other more impactful scenarios where the result is not only an LED difference but a can't-get-there-from-here scenario requiring manually pressing the button after loading a Performance because not all XA control (the other usage of assignable switches) can assume the opposite relationship to the on vs off.

And yet the Arpeggio's state is saveable, in Scenes, Parts and Performances.

Can you two at least see why a user might expect that Assignable Switches have a saveable state other than their default?

You are looking at this from the viewpoint that they are both conditions (state) of a button… which leads to the (erroneous) conclusion that this would be a simple thing.

It does not take into account that the various MIDI controllers have a mandatory status that must be met when a program is recalled.

The Assign Switches are Controllers which, as documented, reset to a default setting, Off.
Arpeggios and their state are apart of this synthesizer — and by no means a universal function throughout MIDI. It’s state is stored as apart of the MONTAGE Performance. And is in an entirely different universe from physical Controllers.

In order for MIDI to be useful across multiple manufacturers and products, the Controller default resets are respected across all of MIDI. And are designed to support the program making sound when initially recalled.

The position of the MW is not a storable setting. What is storable is the value of destination parameter… not the MW position,
The position of the FC is not a storable setting. What is storable is the value of the destination parameter… not the FC position.
The position of the PB Wheel is not storable. What is storable is the tuning of the pitch parameter.
The position of Aftertouch is not storable. What is storable is the value of the destination parameter.
In the MODX/MONTAGE the position of the Assign Switch is not storable. What is storable is value of the destination parameter.

It is the same as with standard MIDI controllers… They have a default condition. Yamaha designated Off (minimum, 0) as the default for these assign switches.

The solution to the fact that several of these controllers would need to be motorized to fulfill your type of request. Storing the position of the MW would require a motor. Instead, the system opted to memorize the value of the parameter that the MW is set to change, and respect the default that MW defaults to minimum 0 whenever a new program is recalled.

Just because the Assign Switches are buttons, I guess makes you think of them as different, they are not. Think of them like other controllers. They default to minimum (0) …their only other value is maximum (127). Default is minimum Off.
It’s not that you couldn’t have On memorized but it is not what is specified here..

The solution is handled (as outlined several times) by storing the destination value at the setting you desire, and use the RATIO inside the Control Set to flip it in the direction necessary.

This way you can use the MW to either fade in a sound 0 to 127 (min to max) or you can have the minimum to maximum 0 to 127 movement work in reverse by using a negative Ratio… as you increase the MW 0 toward 127 (which is the way it always works) you are subtracting values to get a reverse response. When the same MW has to address as many as 8 Parts, simultaneously, and potentially address each one quite differently, we find this method quite useful.

The XA CONTROLs that use the Assign Switches as On/Off are another case in point. The alternate “articulation” are activated when the switch is engaged (On)… it uses these because their default condition is Off (minimum). If you are using them to switch between fully active Elements, you would setup so the Elements you want to sound initially are biased to the OFF position, and the Elements you subsequently want to switch to are biased to the ON position.

Thank you all for the detailed information.

FYI I tried using a negative ratio, but that did not work correctly -- it just caused the part to always be "Mono", no matter whether the "ASSIGN 1" was on or off. What I had to do, instead, is to create a "Custom Curve" with the max value at 0 and the min value at 127. Then it worked.

It's not ideal, but it works well enough. As in: it would be neat for me to have some kind of convention where for my performances "ASSIGN 1" always represents "Poly" as "on" and "Mono" as "off"... but some performances default to "Poly" and some to "Mono".... Not to mention it would be neat to be able to create scenes that could flip from one to the other.

FWIW, it seems clear to me that the feature could be implemented if they wanted... in fact, it is, for the super knob. But it's definitely not the end of the world.

Thanks, again,

Z

Thank you all for the detailed information.

FYI I tried using a negative ratio, but that did not work correctly

If it did not work correctly it is likely because it was incorrectly applied, or the positive value was not large enough to flip the setting. Try at least (+17) on the Standard (Ramp) Curve. When flipping something from Off to On with a linear curve.. all values from minimum to halfway are Off, all values above halfway are On.
The Standard Curve reaches the ceiling at precisely 32… so 0-16 is Off, 17-32 is On.

Recall ”Soprano Soft AF1”
The “Motion Control” > Overview” screen indicates [A.SW 1] is assigned in Part 1

Set the Part from “Common” to “Part 1”
Tap the box “Edit Part 1 Control Settings”
Destination 4 = “Mono/Poly”

When the Switch is Off the Part is Polyphonic (Poly)
When you engage the [A.SW 1] it’s the negative Ratio that flips it to Mono (-17)

The parameter it is affecting is highlighted here:

If the stored condition is MONO, then a positive Ratio will flip the direction and make the Part POLY