Thank you David, i will check tonight (here it's morning), it's more clear, i was thinking to put the chanel 1 for the part 9, so it's put channel 9 to part 1, channel 10 to part 2 ....

Joel wrote:

Thank you David, i will check tonight (here it's morning), it's more clear, i was thinking to put the chanel 1 for the part 9, so it's put channel 9 to part 1, channel 10 to part 2 ....

Yes, you'll be instructing channel 1 to transmit a MIDI signal to part 9 so that it will sound. You could assign any of them (1 thru 8) to transmit to channel 9 but I just went in order. 1 to 9, 2 to 10, 3 to 11, 4 to 12, 5 to 13, 6 to 14, 7 to 15 & 8 to 16. I just completed a 16 part FMX performance just because I can. It's enormous.

How many notes were you playing simultaneously with the 16 part sound? I'd added an extra 2 parts to the 8 keyboard control parts - when I looked at the activity meters in the mixing page if I only played a single note the meters moved in time but if I played a 5/6 note chord there was an audible delay in the sound playing which you could see in the meters. I'd imagine it's coming from the midi out to in - it does give a chorused effect on some sounds too.

I guess it shows tho that it's possible to address all 16 parts. What would be good if there was a way to combine groups of sounds within the 16 parts and then switch between them with button selection - I know scene buttons and mutes can do the same thing.

david, can you do a you tube of your wall of sound? I really wish BM would jump into one of your posts as Id like to hear his input and the possibilities of making this a firmware update without having to mess with the Midi.........

We do know that the Montage is 16 part multitimbral. Of course you would expect to lose polyphony playing a yuugh number of parts simultaneously. I was asking myself why does it matter whether the MIDI signal is coming from a remote board or internally. After all it's just a signal. There shouldn't be any delay effect different from an external source so I don't understand what would be causing any echos or delays or chorus effects. MIDI sends a signal and the tone generator responds accordingly.

Does anyone know why the Montage tone generator would respond differently to an internal vs and external MIDI signal? Is there a looping issue that needs to be isolated?

At first I created a haphazard 16 part performance that had echos probably coming from a part program that I had randomly selected so I went back to something simpler like single part FMX performance used as building blocks like I illustrated here. "Grouped parts" within a 16 part performance would be a neat feature so that you don't have to mute parts or experience part interruptions like with changing performances. Remember that you can always split the keyboard up as well.

On many performances not all parts play simultaneously either depending on controls so there are ways to get creative with controlling a large 16 part performance. The primary thing for a live performer who has a very specific need to have more than 8 parts available within a single performance is that now it can be accomplished with a single Montage. Even if they only need 12 parts as an absolute minimum necessity. Now they don't have to bring/buy a second keyboard although it's not a bad idea to always have a backup. Maybe you'll have to use the mute/unmute button or split the keys until Yamaha can include a part grouping function within a performance. Something like a "group mute" or "group unmute" function where you only have to perform a single press to activate/deactivate several parts simultaneously.

I'll try to make a youtube demo if I get some time. I'd like to experiment with this more as well.

Phil wrote:

How many notes were you playing simultaneously with the 16 part sound? I'd added an extra 2 parts to the 8 keyboard control parts - when I looked at the activity meters in the mixing page if I only played a single note the meters moved in time but if I played a 5/6 note chord there was an audible delay in the sound playing which you could see in the meters. I'd imagine it's coming from the midi out to in - it does give a chorused effect on some sounds too.

I'm not sure. Exceeding polyphony would cause notes to drop out but what's causing a delay? I'll continue to try and isolate the issue or reproduce it under certain circumstances. I suspect/hope that Yamaha is addressing this currently which is why the silence because this would be a gigantic leap forward from 8 parts only to 16 parts and with minimal effort. Is there such a thing as a MIDI loop isolator? Usually you're not routing a MIDI cable from the source back to the same source. I don't think I noticed any delays playing chords with my FMX 16 part performance although I was testing the polyphony to see what/if anything would drop out.

"A single MIDI link can carry up to sixteen channels of information, each of which can be routed to a separate device.MIDI carries event messages that specify notation, pitch and velocity, control signals for parameters such as volume, vibrato, audio panning, cues, and clock signals that set and synchronize tempo between multiple devices. These messages are sent via a MIDI cable to other devices where they control sound generation and other features."

I suppose that if you were exceeding the maximum number of 16 information channels or event messages that this would cause a delayed response or staggered messaging.

Hello, it's work and without midi echo even if local control is set to "on" on your user performance.
I have understand why, because for each part with keyboard control you define a midi channel output different thant the default midi channel.
Part 1 set to send part 9 on channel 9==> so the midi note going out part1 are send to midi 9 so they don't return to part 1 in channel midi 1 default midi receive channel.

If you want to have a part with keyboard control and no layer with other part, just active the zone and set "off" to the midi out channel setting, like this the part can play on keyboard control and will not send by default notes he's midi default channel who will not come back via the midi cable.

But, cause there is a but, all preset and library will receive midi echo by default cause zone are not active, so part 1 send to channel 1 and the midi note come back in channel 1 thru the cable, same for part2 ....

If you want to use this tip, you need to save all preset performance you want to work with in user and set the zone active on each part and set channel to off, a huge work, or each time you use a preset performance, you need to go to utility, Midi I/O and set local control to off.

Joel wrote:

Hello, it's work and without midi echo even if local control is set to "on" on your user performance.
I have understand why, because for each part with keyboard control you define a midi channel output different than the default midi channel.
Part 1 set to send part 9 on channel 9==> so the midi note going out part1 are send to midi 9 so they don't return to part 1 in channel midi 1 default midi receive channel.

Are you saying that this is a problem or that it works?

Hi.
- your tip work for all user performances you edit like this.
- you have the midi echo problem on all preset performances and for library downloaded/buy who are not edit with zone setting part.

I'm lost.........

@Dave. Did you follow my example and create a 9 part performance? and did it work?