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programming a specific sound...

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Gabi
 Gabi
Posts: 0
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Topic starter
 

I´d like to program this old fashioned depeche mode sound from the 80ies on the montage

https://youtu.be/A0ZkTndbHpk?t=1m40s

(at minute 1:40)

sounds like FM but is it really? How to go about it? any suggestions?

also this crazy stuff at 1:07, however they do it, would be fun

https://youtu.be/8_exjjrVCws?t=1m4s

I know how to program a sound from scratch that I like by now, but when it comes to imitating something I´m lost...

 
Posted : 04/05/2017 10:41 pm
Jason
Posts: 8259
Illustrious Member
 

Since there's an e-piano-ish "sparkly" pad sound (2 measures of whole notes, then one measure of half notes, back to a whole note measure - ending the phrase) and also an analog-ish "lead" 16th note pattern (16th note rest, 3 16th notes, 16th note rest, 16th note ... etc). It'd help to know which sound. The pad sounds fairly FM-ish. The lead probably is not.

For the lead sound, you can probably pull up something pretty close. My process for covers sometimes involves just doing a few minutes of research on the boards used by an artist. There's less stuff to sort through when there's only one keyboardist - Depeche Mode had several (at a time) since most of their stuff is synth based. The research helps identify some trends in go-to keyboards and then those keyboards themselves tend to have go-to sounds that tend to show up as presets on Rompler flagships. Going through that process, I'd start to listen to what Montage has that matches. Sometimes forums have other people debating sounds for a given artist or tune. Not necessary to do the research - but 15-30 minutes of research may save time in fishing for sounds starting from scratch. I wouldn't search for too long, because usually one resorts to building from scratch as it tends to go faster that way most of the time. There's a learning curve - so adjust as necessary according to where you're at.

For the sparkly pad - there's really a ton of options there. You don't have to nail it. Even just a Rhodes sound is good enough - although it's more FM EP. Gentle FM EP is close enough for me. I just looked at the FM piano section. Chords seem like Am | Adim7 | Dm7/A Am7 (can drop the 3rd) | Am

At 1:07 - I'm guessing you want it all. The Choir-y pad, the melodic drums with slowly falling gliss ("pitch bend") and the "random" computery sound.

Should be pretty easy to do considering there seems to be lots of sonic separation between all the different parts. Nothing really drowns out the other - so it gives a clear reference to shoot for.

I guess what I'm suggesting is not to program much at all - you can get away with presets pretty well then tweak them once you're in the ballpark. My goal is to gig - so I try not to spend a ton of time between programming my performance and being able to play. The sound can evolve over time.

Current Yamaha Synthesizers: Montage Classic 7, Motif XF6, S90XS, MO6, EX5R

 
Posted : 05/05/2017 1:03 am
Gabi
 Gabi
Posts: 0
Estimable Member
Topic starter
 

I just wanted the DM lead sound, here at 20:40 you can see the actual synth, well, some nerd out there will probably recognize it even thow you can´t see much 😉 Mhhh, but it doesn´t sound the same as the record at all. That live sound is pretty basic, I prefer the one on the album!

https://youtu.be/HVGcPWwfV5Q?t=20m38s

as far as the Goldfrapp sound, how do they do the slowly falling gliss is what I was wondering. pitch bend ok, but if I try that I can´t get acurate notes like they do....

 
Posted : 05/05/2017 7:09 am
Jason
Posts: 8259
Illustrious Member
 

Falling pitch is easily accomplished with PEG or motion sequence. I placed pitch bend in quotes because this isn't literally what would be the method to use - just easy to relate to.

Apparently, the US blocks your youtube video.

"Early Lead" isn't perfect, but I could get through a show playing that for the 16th note lead part.

That little sound effect after the lead before the vocals could be done OK with a quick Bbdim arpeggio using the "FM Metal Glocken" sound. Played at just below 3 octaves above middle-C.

... "Simple Bass" sounds close enough for the bass. Lots of bases around that area that work OK.

Current Yamaha Synthesizers: Montage Classic 7, Motif XF6, S90XS, MO6, EX5R

 
Posted : 05/05/2017 11:34 am
Ron
 Ron
Posts: 0
Eminent Member
 

Depeche Mode Sounds, The big advantage on the montage is that you can select and combine when needed 16 instruments sounds performance presets using the 2 sound engines. and each single instruments sounds you can edit remix program with other sound effects options, and again give the created / combine sounds performances a final mix mastering sound atmosphere with the so many opions in the mix mastering mode Ok you need a couple hours to dive deep in the many effect options and settings but on the end you can reach a almost perfect result to come as close possible to a wat ever sound you want to reproduce on the Yamaha Montage synth. !!. as also specific Depeche Mode / Pet Shop Boys sounds /drum kits atmosphere [Sounds & Recording] demo >>

http://jmp.sh/v/TN0UTWZFvHgjBColpOQg

 
Posted : 05/05/2017 7:36 pm
Gabi
 Gabi
Posts: 0
Estimable Member
Topic starter
 

I tried a falling pitch motion sequence but didn´t get that quite right yet, sounds pretty ridiculous.

that Depeche mode sound, it´s a Roland Jupiter! can see it here:

https://youtu.be/4CwNC5uoMwo?t=34m26s

 
Posted : 06/05/2017 8:04 am
Jason
Posts: 8259
Illustrious Member
 

DM is all about Roland. I watched some Letterman show performance and they had 2-3 Edirol (Roland) PCR-200/300/500 controllers and it looked like a V-Synth GT off to the side and probably other Roland gear for the actual sounds (Edirol is just a controller).

There's a sample called "JP Short Seq" which is kind of close, but not exactly the same. Then there's a JP FM part (not same) and a JP String part. I think what I pointed out is already close enough to get something going.

For the fall, you can practice with:

1) Load up "Init Normal AWM2"
2) Add PART 2 = "Warped Bass Traxx", Copy Part 2->1, Delete Part 2
3) Edit Part 1 (Warped Bass Traxx) - it's an FM part.
4) Go to "Common" (lower left button), Touchscreen "Pitch/Filter" --> "Peg/Scale"
5) Decay1 Time set to 99
6) Decay2 Time set to 97, set Decay2 level to -50
Note: PEG depth was already (default) set to 8 oct)
See how that works as a pitch glide

If you want the note to cut off on its own and not have you do it, you can modify and use:

Decay1 Time = 90, Decay1 Level =-6
Decay2 Time = 0, Decay2 Level= -50
Release Time = 0, Release Level= -50

It won't be completely silent when it hits the -50 value, but will mostly be. You can further refine with an AEG that mutes the volume at the same time the PEG goes to -50. Or you can leave it alone if the low-volume "noise" doesn't matter.

If you're going to do a motion sequence, set the sync to OFF (internal timing) - set the speed to 7. Each-on. Set loop to OFF. Normal ramp (for the pulse). Then, back at Mod-control, use MS Lane 1 as the source and destination PART PITCH - with a normal unipolar ramp of -5. Should get you in the ballpark.

If you want the ramp to stop sooner, increase the speed back at the pulse settings screen (MS Lane settings). Make adjustments to mod control ramp as necessary.

If you want the sound to cut off when it gets to the end, change the standard curve to a user curve. (Mod/Control -> Control Assign)

Input1=0,output=0
Input2=1,output=0
Input3=2,output=0
Input4=3,output=0
Input5=4,output=0
Input6=5,output=0
Input7=126,output=10
Input8=127,output=127

Then make the ratio -16 (still unipolar). This should simulate the same type of curve as was done with the PEG (only without using PEG - PEG should be default for this one). Again, you'll need to use AEG or another motion sequence to cutoff the volume at the end if the artifacts bother you.

Current Yamaha Synthesizers: Montage Classic 7, Motif XF6, S90XS, MO6, EX5R

 
Posted : 06/05/2017 10:00 am
Jason
Posts: 8259
Illustrious Member
 

The falls I gave were "while you push" falls. You could also do an "as you release" fall if you change the AEG so you have sustain after letting go (release) and then start your fall during the release. This would allow for a "strike and release" type gesture to make the fall happen. There's really lots of options here. You could sample a sound that does that and just play it back.

Other DM keyboards:

E-Mu Emulator II (2) - they had a period where each of the 3 keyboard players had 1 or 2 of these.
PPG Wave 2 - I think this was doing the e-piano in a live cut of "Leave In Silence". Not really what I'd consider an iconic keyboard.

Software version of that board .. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40LCju08748

Getting off on a tangent - interesting to dig up old gear sometimes.

Current Yamaha Synthesizers: Montage Classic 7, Motif XF6, S90XS, MO6, EX5R

 
Posted : 06/05/2017 10:04 am
Gabi
 Gabi
Posts: 0
Estimable Member
Topic starter
 

thank you! the JP FM brass part is pretty close, and combined with the JP short seq it´s getting there!

Gotta try the fall thing later.

 
Posted : 07/05/2017 10:52 am
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