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MOXF Series Music Production Synthesizers
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Topic starter
I’m having difficulty getting outside library voices and performances from my moxf to Melas tools and back.
1. I have the following libraries
a. Inspiration in a flash – Yamaha download
b. Twisted Tools– Yamaha download
c. EDM– Yamaha download
d. Bees Knees DPC
e. Vintage Keys DPC
f. Complete Orchestra DPC
2. I loaded them into MOXF from a usb stick
a. Voices and performances seem to work fine.
b. There might be problems since the factory set is so large and the outside libraries are so large – it is hard for me to be sure of the accuracy of all loaded performances and voices.
3. I did a SAVE ALL for each library (however without samples) to a separate memory stick.
a. Did a MOXF reset
b. Reloaded the libraries back into moxf
c. Again everything seems fine
4. So I loaded the libraries from moxf into Melas total library. Did a Moxf reset. Reloaded the libraries from Melas tools to Moxf and weird things started happening.
a. Each bank of every library has some voices in parent/child relationships (Melas terminology) where there shouldn’t be any. No voice that is from a library outside of the MOXF factory set should be a part of a factory performance right? Yet there are several performances claiming outside library voices.
b. Sometimes performances have the name of a factory MOXF performance – but a completely different factory performance playing. Eg. Sunny Beaches is the name but Strummin and Hummin is playing. And this is completely erractic – each new load can rearrange different performances. And not just one – but several
c. In some of the outside performances the voices are not what they claim to be:
1. E.g. string voices that have chromatic percussion sounds in them / brass sounds with guitar sounds and on and on.
2. Some performances have voices inexplicably removed. So that a performance that normally has four voices has 2 or 1.
d. Some voices are completely changed. Overture in Complete Orchestra is sometimes reduced to a monophonic pad – that does not change pitch – so just like the original voice – but with a different element playing.
5. I spent about 5 hours today – reformatted the flashdrive. Reloaded all the libraries into moxf from usb stick. Again they sounded accurate.
6. Then I transmitted the libraries from moxf to Melas tools. Then back to moxf. Again there were several voices/performances that were inaccurate.
7. One of the voices on vintage keys is Pink Floyd 1. I found that the user arp is not loading from Melas to the moxf – causing the voice not to play while the arp is on. That voice is consistent: it works properly when loaded from usb stick. But not when it loads from Melas.
8. I would say that 60 to 75% of the loads are accurate. But I am not familiar with all the performances and voices – so there may be others that have been affected and I am just unaware of their problems.
10. Libraries with fewest if any problems
a. Bees knees – no problems that I have been able to detect.
b. Vintage keys – only Pink Floyd 1 –user arpeggio does not load with voice.
c. Inspiration in a flash
d. None of these have performances.
11. Libraries with problems
a. Complete Orchestra – severe problems – the performances and voices can be completely chaotic after a Melas download.
b. EDM – several voices do not play. Arps missing
c. Twisted tools – less severe – voices missing – arps missing
12. I have the latest driver for moxf v1.10
13. I wrote to John Melas – gave him a screenshot of my midi connections. They are correct. He suggested that I increase the sysex delay to 40ms which I have done. He also suggested that I change my usb cord – which I have also done.
Short of getting a new moxf (which is not possible for me I’m past warranty – or taking it to a service center – also not possible since I live in the middle of the Pacific Ocean and there is no service center anywhere close to me.)
Am I missing something? Is there a protocol for loading that I am missing? Does anyone else have this problem – or am I the only one? Is there an older post that addresses this problem?
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks!
johnb
Posted : 14/11/2015 12:27 pm
You need to work with the data that includes the Samples.
Once you load data into your MOXF, your MOXF places the Waveforms in a list that catalogs the locations of all the Sample data. It places then in the lowest numbered empty location, and as you direct Voice data into the internal USER allocations, the MOXF documents and updates each Voice so that its Elements that use Flash Board Waveforms will be updated with the Wave number location in YOUR Moxf.
This why you needed to make a backup of each and every library (*with sample*) and it should be that ALL data file you use to work in the Melas Waveform Editor. In order to keep the parent-child relationship in tact, you must be working with a file that contains the Samples.
It is the fact that the data is "dynamic" that you are missing. Once you start customizing your Wave ROM (Flash Board) the backup you make is going to be unique to your MOXF. Example, if you load "Inspiration In a Flash", first, then load "Twisted Tools", then EDM... and another MOXF owner loads then in reverse order... Your Waveform Lists will be different.
Waveforms are loaded in and are dynamic, this means they occupy the lowest numbered empty location. As they do so, the individual Voice's data has to updated to reflex and match where this LOAD process is placing the necessary data to make the Voice play properly. Your WAVEFORM LIST will contain the Waveforms From the "Inspiration..." Library occupying the lowest numbered wave locations, while some one else may have them loaded in later numbered locations.
Do you must create a backup FILE that backs up your uniquely ordered Waveform list and the SAMPLES that the waveforms are organizing. It is that file that you want to work with in the Melas Waveform Editor, because it contains the full content and full catalog of YOUR MOXF's data.
Posted : 14/11/2015 2:13 pm
Topic starter
OK - I'm in the process....
Wow this really takes a LONG TIME!
About 50 minutes for Inspiration in a flash - to load
Then another 50 minutes - to save with samples.
Then add Complete Orchestra - about 25 minutes to load
Then about 75 minutes to save with samples - because it has to save ALL samples even those from Inspiration in a flash...
Then add Twisted tools about 15 minutes to load
about 90 minutes to save with samples
I still have 3 more libraries to load! Ugh!
What I should have done is started with the no sample based libraries
Then moved from smallest samples sizes to largest -
Looks like this will take about 8 hours! Wow! I had no idea.
But if this works right - then it will be worth it.
If not....:p
Posted : 15/11/2015 9:53 pm
Topic starter
OK - it worked! The voices are stable and working properly! Yay! Thanks Bad Mister!
Posted : 16/11/2015 11:04 am
"Flash" the word does mean fast, instantaneous... But refers to the access time between pressing a key and hearing/accessing the stored sound. Obviously: The process of "burning" Wave ROM is long and involves coffee and some patience. The numbers are big. Very big. And although speeds are actually pretty good (compared to wave based synth of yesteryear), the size of the data being manipulated is huge.
Back when I started with Yamaha burning Wave ROMs was a more than a 15 hour affair (and we were burning 8MB back then)... And was not something that was available to end users, at all.
Now the BYTES in thousands (KB), millions (MB), billions (GB) are the numbers you are dealing with (plus the conversion time). It takes longer for a MOXF to convert and install Motif XF data, than it does to read and install its own native data, quite naturally. Another good reason to make a MOXF backup of your data.
While it is somewhat easy to picture one million (MB) as a thousand thousands but a billion (GB) is additionally a thousand millions. Not even dollars can help most of us imagine the difference. Time and/or distance are good measuring device for comparison of these rather astronomic numbers... Even if just to compare amounts.
One thousand seconds is 16 minutes and change
One million seconds is a week, four and a half days.
One billion seconds is more than 31 and a half years.
Just saying....
One thousand inches is less than 30 yards - like running to first base
One million inches is just short of 16 miles - more than a half marathon
One billion inches is 15,780+ miles - more than half way 'round the world
Data adds up....
Burning ROM (measured in just minutes nowadays) should only be done when you have time and a clear head. Install only data you will eventually use, don't waste memory on things you will never play.
Posted : 17/11/2015 2:04 pm
