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MASTERING MONTAGE: AN FM-X EXPLORATION PART 1

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Jason
Posts: 8259
Illustrious Member
 

You should be able to hear a difference using the algorithm selected when operator 2's level is 99, operator 1's level is 80, and all other operators set to level 0. Adjusting the feedback should increase the brightness and having maximum feedback should produce a saw wave.

Feedback will control the level of feedback for the single operator that has a feedback loop in the given algorithm. For the demo (which uses algorithm 81 thus far), operator 1 has the feedback loop. I haven't loaded it up to make sure there isn't a programming issue - but I'm assuming the default feedback level for the performance (X7B) is 0 and using the assignable knob for feedback allows you to increase the feedback (offset) to the maximum feedback level.

An example of another FM synth showing the feedback result, see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FkSJ3nTkvI

Note that the DX7 algorithm for the first 2-operator programming in the video - DX7 has the operator numbering reversed for these two operators vs. Montage. Montage has operator 2 on the bottom (carrier) and operator 1 (modulator) feeding operator 2. The DX7 is reversed. So when you're looking at the video - you can pretty much follow along except think "op1" when he says "op2" and think "op2" when he says "op1".

The reference is really for the first part where he demonstrates feedback.

Current Yamaha Synthesizers: Montage Classic 7, Motif XF6, S90XS, MO6, EX5R

 
Posted : 31/03/2017 4:24 am
Bad Mister
Posts: 12303
 

Michael Trigoboff wrote:

I just went through this. Very cool. But the Feedback knob didn't seem to do anything, even though I tried many different configurations. What do I need to do to hear the effect of that knob?

In general, when the Feedback loop is on a Modulator its influence will ultimately result in timbre change of the Carrier it is directed to... this can be subtle or dramatic, it depends on what else is happening at the time. When the Feedback loop includes a Carrier its influence is usually very apparent. (In the Algorithm 81 its on the Modulator)

On the P4 Performance.... set the Part 1 Assign Knobs as follows:
AsgnKnob 6 = 100 - allows for EG Level to be significant (this is the shape of the Modulator's influence)
AsgnKnob 7 = 100 - by OP1 Decay = OP2 Decay we ensure that as long as the sound is held the Modulator will influence the Carrier
AsgnKnob 8 = 100 - allows the Carrier sound to sustain longer while key is held

All others at 0.

As you raise the FEEDBACK AsgnKnob 5, you will hear a fairly dramatic change. As you approach maximum, you can hear Feedback create a bit of chaotic noise.

If the "EG Level" and "OP1 Decay" are maxed, you can get a really gritty noise when Feedback is raised.

Also try different areas of the keyboard, as the influence can be scaled across the keyboard. Often lower notes reveal more as when playing high and adding even higher harmonics, sometimes (quite often actually with FM) you are creating symphonies and sounds only your dog can hear. So if you are not hearing the response be sure to try lower, mid and then high ranges when sonically testing the results.

AsgnKnob 5 = 64
AsgnKnob 6 = 100
AsgnKnob 7 = 100
AsgnKnob 8 = 100

in the mid and bass ranges makes a hollow tone...
Raise Feedback (Knob 5) to 127 and the sound is entirely different

 
Posted : 31/03/2017 4:37 pm
Michael Trigoboff
Posts: 0
Honorable Member
 

Thanks, Bad Mister, that worked great. Excellent tutorial.

 
Posted : 01/04/2017 12:06 am
 G
Posts: 0
New Member
 

Hello,

I would like to learn FM-X with these tutorials on my MODX.

.X7B files are different from .X8B ones and are not compatible with MODX Connect (File Load Error) when renaming them.

Does a converter exist ?

 
Posted : 04/11/2018 5:54 pm
Bad Mister
Posts: 12303
 

Hello,

I would like to learn FM-X with these tutorials on my MODX.

.X7B files are different from .X8B ones and are not compatible with MODX Connect (File Load Error) when renaming them.

Does a converter exist ?

Thanks for your interest in the FM-X tutorials... a version of this series of articles will be made available for the MODX (with appropriate files) shortly.

The "CONNECT" files are not transferable. We'll see if we can get compatible files posted in short order.

 
Posted : 04/11/2018 7:09 pm
Posts: 3
New Member
 

I am trying to get the X7B files for this series of articles. I know that X7B is for Montage and X8B is for MODX. The 'Montage' version of these articles doesn't download the X7B any more (file not found). Is there any way I can get the X7Bs?

 
Posted : 15/08/2024 7:12 pm
Antony
Posts: 745
Prominent Member
 

Posted by: steven

I am trying to get the X7B files for this series of articles. I know that X7B is for Montage and X8B is for MODX. The 'Montage' version of these articles doesn't download the X7B any more (file not found). Is there any way I can get the X7Bs?

Are you sure its not an  ".X8L" or ".X7L" you're looking for?  

Maybe someone knows where the current link is.  Very often,  its not that they're "gone",  its just that they've been moved.  Broken Links have been a point of frustration for a long time. 

Without intending to be flippant,  you can still create your own Presets by following the Exercises,  which in itself is good practice and helps the knowledge stick.

I did this with Manny Fernandes's FM Tutorials, because my MODX didn't have the same Controls as a Montage,  so I had to build my own "Control Assigns".   Yes, it was a bit painful,  but helped me learn and understand things better. 

 

IIRC...  I think I downloaded a "Montage Library" File,  but it still worked on my MODX. 

Of course, this doesn't help if you can't find any Library Files at all. 

 

 

 
Posted : 17/08/2024 3:51 am
 Toby
Posts: 394
Honorable Member
 

I am trying to get the X7B files for this series of articles. I know that X7B is for Montage and X8B is for MODX. The 'Montage' version of these articles doesn't download the X7B any more (file not found). Is there any way I can get the X7Bs?

I suggest that you use the 'Contact Us' link at the bottom right of this page and:

1. tell Yamaha Support the link is broken - give them the url to the page with the broken link

2. ask them to send you the file.

 
Posted : 17/08/2024 4:38 pm
Jason
Posts: 8259
Illustrious Member
 

The original article, now located here:

 

https://yamahasynth.com/learn/montage-series-synthesizers/mastering-montage-fm-x-exploration-part-1/

 

... references a file P4.X7B (.zip).  Typically after the Yamaha forum changes its directory structure and most everything gets lost in the shuffle, someone will voice having issue with this or that content and one-by-one Yamaha support would upload the content somewhere and provide a new link that works for another few months.

 

Currently part 1 of this article series points to: https://yamahasynth.com/images/easyblog_articles/1674/P4.X7B.zip

 

... and part 2 of this article series points to: https://yamahasynth.com/images/easyblog_articles/1676/P3.X7B.zip

 

Neither are available.

 

This post was modified 4 months ago by Jason

Current Yamaha Synthesizers: Montage Classic 7, Motif XF6, S90XS, MO6, EX5R

 
Posted : 17/08/2024 5:35 pm
Jason
Posts: 8259
Illustrious Member
 

... I guess as another data point, the MODX version of this article:

 

https://yamahasynth.com/learn/modx-series-synthesizers/mastering-modx-fm-x-exploration-part-i/

 

Points to P4.X8B.zip (which only works for MODX) and this file does exist.

 

https://yamahasynth.com/wp-content/uploads/images/zip/P4.X8B.zip

 

I tried replacing the filename above using the same path with the Montage file (P4.X7B.zip) but it was not found there either.

 

It would be a lot easier if all of this X7B/X8B bulk dump data was hosted on Soundmondo because that's exactly what service Soundmondo provides.

This post was modified 4 months ago by Jason

Current Yamaha Synthesizers: Montage Classic 7, Motif XF6, S90XS, MO6, EX5R

 
Posted : 17/08/2024 5:49 pm
Antony
Posts: 745
Prominent Member
 

There is another series of FM-X Tutorials by Dr Manny Fernandez...

IIRC  thetly were called

 

FM XPLORER

FM XPERT

I think used Library File  (X8L,  X7L).

Maybe these are still available?  

 

I'm still not sure what "B" files are  (X8B, X7B). I'd not heard of them till reading this thread. 

 

 
Posted : 18/08/2024 3:10 am
Jason
Posts: 8259
Illustrious Member
 

The "B" files are bulk dump files.  Basically the same thing as a bulk data dump which produces a mess of SysEx data that represents all of the current Performance settings in your edit buffer along with a header you could remove to get back to a raw dump.

 

Soundmondo uses this kind of data (although you don't ever see these files - it's direct dump to/from your instrument).  Montage Connect and MODX Connect were applications in the last generation that could create X[7,8]B files and load them into your instrument.

Current Yamaha Synthesizers: Montage Classic 7, Motif XF6, S90XS, MO6, EX5R

 
Posted : 18/08/2024 8:16 pm
Antony reacted
Posts: 3
New Member
 

Posted by: Toby

I am trying to get the X7B files for this series of articles. I know that X7B is for Montage and X8B is for MODX. The 'Montage' version of these articles doesn't download the X7B any more (file not found). Is there any way I can get the X7Bs?

I suggest that you use the 'Contact Us' link at the bottom right of this page and:

1. tell Yamaha Support the link is broken - give them the url to the page with the broken link

2. ask them to send you the file.

 

Thanks Toby. I did use 'Contact Us' in an e-mail as you suggested. They were quick to find the P4.X7B file and send it to me as an attachment. Then I downloaded it to my computer and was able to verify it worked on my Montage (using the Contact app to LOAD the file from my computer to my Montage).

Here is the reply (from synthesizers@yamaha.com):

    "Here is the X7B file. We are doing site maintenance at the moment but will update the article once that’s complete"

I don't know how to upload the file to this thread for others to use. When the article gets updated (all 4 parts) and the links work again I'll let others know.

 

 
Posted : 19/08/2024 11:11 pm
Posts: 56
Trusted Member
 

The link gives me a page not found error. Am I missing something?

Control Room: Fantom 7 | JV 2080 | Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Yamaha TF5 | Mackie MCU | CMC AI, QC, TP
Keyboard Station: Kronos 2 88 | Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Focusrite 18i20 | CMC TP
Editing Station: Montage M8x | Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Focusrite Scarlett 2i2
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chris Duncan
Atlanta, GA, USA, Earth

 
Posted : 20/08/2024 11:35 am
 Toby
Posts: 394
Honorable Member
 

If you hover over the link it should show you 'synthesizers@yamaha.com'.

 
Posted : 20/08/2024 4:51 pm
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