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Recording via MIDI in Logic Pro - Struggles with using multiple tracks

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Robbie
Posts: 0
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Topic starter
 

Hello,

I have followed the tutorial in setting up the Montage for use in Logic Pro and all of my OS and drivers are up to date. I am able to create a new midi track and record as expected, however, as soon as I create a second track and select a new sound on the montage, it changes the sound of the previously recorded track. Meaning, I can only use the Montage for one track via Midi? Or, do I really need to change the Midi I/O ch. on the montage touchscreen for every new track I use? And am I limited to 16?

Perhaps this is a simple user error (I am hoping). Any help or insight would be greatly appreciated as I have spent hours trying to figure this out.

Thank You.

 
Posted : 03/09/2017 10:08 pm
Bad Mister
Posts: 12303
 

It's difficult, without details, to tell you exactly what your missing.

I am able to create a new midi track and record as expected, however, as soon as I create a second track and select a new sound on the montage, it changes the sound of the previously recorded track.

We could make guesses about what sound you selected for your first track and what sound you tried to select for your second track, but it probably would be easier to explain what is happening to you if there were specifics.

When you are attempting to use the MONTAGE as a 16 Part multi-timbral tone engine with a DAW you should set select the following initialized template:

Press [CATEGORY SEARCH]
Touch "Init" > select "Multi/GM"

This init template places a Program in each of the 16 Parts... you can then, each by each, change them to the instrument sound you wish to use.
From the HOME screen of the MULTI/GM Performance, you can select individual sounds for the Parts.
Select [PART SELECT 1]
[SHIFT] + [CATEGORY SEARCH]
The "Part 1 Category Search" screen appears
Set the "Attribute" = SINGLE.
This will allow you Search through those Single Part programs (green)

Repeat by selecting each
Part in turn, and assigning a Single Part program to each slot.

Can you you give us any idea of what you did?
Was it at all similar to the outline above?
If not, try it, and see if you have success, then get back to use with questions...

Let us know.

You asked are you limited to 16 MIDI Tracks... the limit is you can play sixteen MIDI Channels at once, the MONTAGE is 16 Part multi-timbral. You can easily break that limitation with your software by using the Freeze function. Most professional DAWs offer a method to render audio from the MIDI Track... you can then mute the first set of 16, while you build more with a 'second instance' of your hardware.

MONTAGE features 16 Part MIDI, plus the ability to transfer 32 buses of audio... so you can render 16 stereo Audio Track simultaneously. So even if you don't know how to use the Freeze function, you can render audio at anytime... if you need to keep the MIDI data simply place it in a safety folder and mute it... you can always go back to the MIDI data if you discover you want to re-render its audio.

 
Posted : 03/09/2017 10:56 pm
Robbie
Posts: 0
New Member
Topic starter
 

Thanks for your quick response. Perhaps I am using wrong settings on the Montage -- hopefully I can explain a bit better this time.

I've attached a couple screenshots, the first being how I add a new MIDI track, which works perfectly when I only have 1 track. Let's say I'm selecting Synth Lead > FM Vocal Lead on the Montage as my voice, I record and everything is great.

In screenshot two, you'll see I've added another MIDI track. I want to add some percussion now, so on this track, I select Drum/Perc > Real Drums Kit on the Montage. Unlike standard MIDI keyboard behavior, where these two voices should be independent, the voices of my track one are now changed from Synth Lead > FM Vocal Lead to my newly selected (on a separate track 2) drum voice. It's as if it disregards other tracks recorded with the Montage and overrides their voices when you select a new one.

Does this make sense? It seems like maybe I am just missing one little detail/setting here. Or maybe you can recommend a tutorial or better way to use Montages voices as MIDI for recording? Would a MIDI to USB cable produce different results?

Attached files

 
Posted : 04/09/2017 12:25 am
Jason
Posts: 8260
Illustrious Member
 

Your second screenshot shows both tracks 1&2 point to the same MIDI channel (MIDI channel 1). If using MIDI mode = multi (and not single channel) then PART 2 = MIDI Channel 2, PART 3 = MIDI Channel 3, ... and so on.

Not sure how this is setup - so not sure if the setup reflects intent or not.

Note: MIDI mode = single channel is different than the "SINGLE" attribute when searching for a PART type. Same word - but different contexts. The "SINGLE" means a PART which does not rely on other (more than one) PARTs to represent the full instrument. MIDI mode = Single Channel is a utility setting which changes how the MIDI communication works (all PARTs on a single MIDI channel - or all PARTs on multiple MIDI channels).

Current Yamaha Synthesizers: Montage Classic 7, Motif XF6, S90XS, MO6, EX5R

 
Posted : 04/09/2017 2:03 am
Robbie
Posts: 0
New Member
Topic starter
 

Jason,

Thanks for your response. Your Note seems like it may be the answer to what I am struggling with, but I am still having trouble understanding. I guess all I really need to know is how to use the voices on the Montage as single MIDI tracks in logic pro. So to record with one voice on a track 1, and switch to a different voice on a track 2, and so on... Perhaps using "Software instrument" instead of "External Midi"?

 
Posted : 04/09/2017 2:36 am
Jason
Posts: 8260
Illustrious Member
 

I can't really help with Logic since I'm not a MAC user. Perhaps review the existing guide:

http://www.yamahasynth.com/blog/connecting-montage-and-logic-pro-x-new

Guide also recommends using Montage Connect to manage performance/setting recall vs. MSB/LSB+PC. I personally do not do this, but you may want to follow the guidance if you're having problems.

So far the tutorial only shows a single channel with hints that perhaps part 2 will dig in more - not finding part 2 at the moment.

Note that the discussion has some answers to tutorial follow-up questions. They are not related to your situation - but may be helpful:

https://yamahasynth.com/forum/connecting-montage-and-logic-pro-x

Some generic help here:

https://www.yamahasynth.com/forum/logic-pro

... I still don't have my Montage plugged in - but I believe the general rundown is place single-part instruments in any of the 16 slots. On your DAW side - assuming you have MIDI set to multi-channel, then you want to have tracks listening to each channel. So you would have one track at MIDI channel 1, the next track at MIDI channel 2, and so on. Once the DAW is ready - you would SELECT which PART you want. One way to do this is to go to [PERFORMANCE] (HOME) and touch the PART corresponding to which one you want to select. Or you could use buttons to select the part. See the following guidance from another tutorial/post:

Source: https://www.yamahasynth.com/forum/setting-up-montage-with-pro-tools#reply-21157

POWER TIP: When working in a Multi/GM setup where there is a PART in each slot, turn the "KBD CTRL" icon OFF for each Part - this will allow you to address just the currently selected Montage Part. You can press the [PART CONTROL] button (right side top row).
When [PART CONTROL] is lit on the front panel, the first two rows of eight buttons become PART SELECT [1]-[16]. You will use these to select the PART you are communicating with currently.

Notice that when you use "Multi/GM" - LOCAL CONTROL is turned OFF for all PARTs. Therefore, you will not see any MIDI activity (for a specific PART) until you -select- a PART using one of the two methods above (touch screen or buttons).

Again, PART1 = Midi CH 1, PART2 = MIDI CH 2, and so on ... So setup your DAW to receive each. The Logic tutorial does have a screenshot showing where to change the MIDI channel for each track.

Using one track per PART - AND matching the track's MIDI Channel to the PART Number - AND ensuring Montage is setup for MIDI mode = multi channel -- these will ensure you have one track per PART ("instrument") and recording each will keep a PART separated from all others. Upon playback (DAW to Montage) you'll get all the instruments playing on their own channel - and what you expect will happen. The burden on you is that when you want to change instruments - on Montage you have to follow the steps to SELECT the PART (instrument) you want to target. This is the guidance to use the touchscreen or buttons and reference to another thread for details.

On the DAW side - the "catch-all" configuration would be to have 16 MIDI tracks (like you show for 1 and 2) but be sure they show "CH 1" for the first of these tracks, "CH 2" for the second, and so on through "CH 16" for the sixteenth. You may not be using all 16 tracks - but if you have this on the DAW as a saved "template" (not sure exactly how Logic works - sure you can save this somehow even if not called a template) - then you could load this up for any "Multi/GM" session and the DAW would be ready to record anything you throw at it.

Your question regarding external midi vs. software instrument is answered in the tutorial - or at least you can copy what's in the tutorial.

Here's another look at the DAW side from a non-Montage source:

https://www.logicprohelp.com/instruments-tracks-midi-channels/

Note they just show track 3 is set to MIDI Channel 3. They have set track 1 as MIDI Channel 1, track 2 as MIDI Channel 2, ... and so on.

I'm most focused on the "3. Set Each Logic Track’s MIDI Channel." portion of that tutorial although other parts of the tutorial may be helpful.

Current Yamaha Synthesizers: Montage Classic 7, Motif XF6, S90XS, MO6, EX5R

 
Posted : 04/09/2017 6:14 am
Sladjan
Posts: 0
New Member
 

Robbie wrote:

Jason,

Thanks for your response. Your Note seems like it may be the answer to what I am struggling with, but I am still having trouble understanding. I guess all I really need to know is how to use the voices on the Montage as single MIDI tracks in logic pro. So to record with one voice on a track 1, and switch to a different voice on a track 2, and so on... Perhaps using "Software instrument" instead of "External Midi"?

1.
You have to select on the Montage the Multi/GM as BadMister told you. From that point on, you have 16 parts available on the Montage, each with a different midi channel.

2. Using software instrument on logic means using a virtual instrument like Kontakt or Logics own virtual instruments.

3. When you open a first midi track on Logic, it will probably be set to Midichannel 1. You can see that clearly in the inspector. I haven't used Logic for quite a while.
For example, now you can record piano on the first track in Logic. Simply select a single part piano on Montage (the green ones) and record a small test clip. Now, insert another track in logic, put the Midichannel to 2 and select a different sound on Montage on Part2. The previously recorded Piano shouldn't change, and you will additionally hear your sound from part 2 which goes into track 2 on Logic on Midichannel 2. And so on. It is not really that difficult. You just need to set a different midi channel for each track.

 
Posted : 04/09/2017 10:40 am
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