We need a better description with details of what your doing.

Based on what you written thus far, we cannot give you a definitive answer. An Arpeggio is not apart of the Voice, like the Oscillator or Filter, it is added to the Voice like EQ or Reverb. So simply calling up a Voice (via a Program Change) does not necessarily recall the Arpeggio. And since there are different Types of ARPs, different Key Modes, etc., its not possible to give a "one solution works for all" kind of answer.

You will simply need to provide more details.

Try thinking of your Motif XF as a combination of devices in one box. The Voice parameters versus Part parameters, when you place a Voice in a PART, you are taking an instrument and plugging it into the channel of a mixer. A very unique mixer to be sure, but some parameters you inherit from the Mixer.

Picture what you're trying to do in a real world sense...

Review your Part parameters... The Arp parameters...

Try recording the Voice with arp in a blank Song or Pattern, find what's different in your Song.

If you'd like our help, more details please.

I'll try to clarify.

I am in Song mode in song that I am working; I am using all 16 tracks. I enter the appropriate Program Change in Track 5 to insert a diffferent voice into Track 5 at a non-used (no midi data) section of that track at measure 10. I then start the song and let it play to measure 11, and I can see in the display that the newly inserted voice is now "active" within that track. I hit the record button, select track 10, select ARP tab, select the arpeggio I want to use, make sure the Arpeggio with voice parameter is on, make sure the Arpeggio on/off button is lit, and hit the C3 key. No arpeggio plays. I hear the base note, but no arpeggio. If I switch to Voice mode and select that voice, the arpeggio plays fine. I've tried this in a blank song with nothing else in it with the same results.

I enter the appropriate Program Change in Track 5 to insert a diffferent voice into Track 5 at a non-used (no midi data) section of that track at measure 10.

I hit the record button, select track 10, select ARP tab, select the arpeggio I want to use, make sure the Arpeggio with voice parameter is on, make sure the Arpeggio on/off button is lit, and hit the C3 key.

are you recording on track 5 or track 10? (Im confused)
Is this a typo?

"Arpeggio with Voice"(sic) if you meant "Voice with ARP" this should not be used in this context...Is this another typo?
If you want a Voice to bring along its Arpeggio you should be using "Parameter with Voice".

When "Parameter with Voice" is set to ON prior to assigning a Voice to a PART, the following settings will be copied from the Voice (the parameter setting will be imported *with* the Voice):

• Arpeggio settings
• Filter Cutoff Frequency
• Filter Resonance
• Amplitude EG
• Filter EG
• Pitch Bend Range (Upper/Lower)
• Note Shift
Note: Regardless of the Parameter with Voice setting, the following settings are always copied when a Normal Voice is selected: Mono/Poly, Porta Sw (Portamento Part Switch), Porta Time (Portamento Time) and Porta Mode (Portamento Mode).

Yes, sorry; typo on "select track 10", should be "select track 5". Everything takes place in Track 5. I was not near the keyboard and was trying to remember the menu/screen from memory. The attached images show the "Arpeggio" tab, and the screen that it leads to. The "Voice with Arp" field is on the 2nd screen. I will try some more things to see if I can get this to work. Thanks, again, for your help/feedback.

Your goal is certainly accomplish able, if I'm following you. You have used all your tracks, but have space on some tracks to insert Program Changes to recall a different instrument. And you want to record to that track starting at a specific measure using the Arpeggiator.

This is all possible. It is tricky, however, for several reasons... Some of which you point out.
1) You musically must have a pause in which you can insert the Program Change event such that it is not detected.
2) You must setup to record the new data recognizing that you will have altered information from that point forward for this track. This means you must ensure that both the measures before and after your new data recall their respective setups.

Translation: the sequencer typically memorizes the most recent setting you make when you fill-in the RECORD SETUP dialog box. And since MIDI data 'persists' (will remain as changed until it receives a command to change again), you may have to go back and restore your initial settings; you must ensure your original settings are restored by the appropriate MIDI commands. Once you use Program Changes you must use them throughout the track to ensure the appropriate instrument Voice is restored just prior to the Note-On data for that instrument.

In addition to the Program Change, you may want to pay attention to changes in volume, pan position, Effect Sends to the System Reverb and Chorus effects, etc., that may need to be adjusted. Also, if the Track in question contains a PART whose INSERT SWITCH is activated (8 Parts can have their dual Insertion Effects activated) you will inherit this status, and you new Program will be able to access its own set of Insert Effects. If the INS SW is not activated, you new Program will not be able to use its INSERTS.

But, you should be able to record the ARPEGGIATOR starting at any measure, and you can even have the sequencer automatically Punch Out.
So we can tell you that you should be able to accomplish what you have explained.

Your screenshots show track 1... Not 5, not even 10, and set to record at measure 001 🙂 So we guess you are saying this is "similar" to what you are doing, is that correct? We should not take the screenshots as specifically what you are doing, is that right?

Correct, I found the screen shots on the web and posted the links. I just wanted to convey the context of the menus that I am working with.

Yes you are correct (as always), this is tricky, and is a high maintenance item - especially if you are doing this in multiple tracks (and I am). It gets especially complicated if effects are introduced mid-track. You are also correct in that there will be a perceptible "lag" if the new voice is inserted in a busy section of the song, so placement is critical.

Below is a generic example of how I am using midi commands to insert a new voice in some empty measures of one specific track. Everything except the System Reset is in Track #5:

M=Measure

M1:01:000 System Reset (in Track 1)
M2:01:000 Set ORIGINAL Voice
M2:01:100 Set ORIGINALVolume (CC 07 - Track Volume)
M2:01:200 Set ORIGINAL Pan
M2:01:300 Set Optional Effect(s) - Chorus, etc.
M3 - M20: Notes Played

M21-M49 are empty, so I want to insert another voice to make use of these measures in this track:

M21:01:000 Set NEW Voice
M21:01:100 Set NEW Volume (CC 07 - Track Volume)
M21:01:200 Set NEW Pan
M21:01:300 Remove Previously Set Optional Effect(s) - Chorus, etc.
M21:01:400 Set Optional Effect(s) - Chorus, etc.
M22 - M48: Notes Played

M49:01:000 Set ORIGINAL Voice
M49:01:100 Set ORIGINALVolume (CC 07 - Track Volume)
M49:01:200 Set ORIGINAL Pan
M49:01:300 Remove Previously Set Optional Effect(s) - Chorus, etc.
M49:01:400 Set Optional Effect(s) - Chorus, etc.
M50 - M100: Notes Played

That's the basic setup for what I am doing now. Is there a better way: Should these be done in a different order? Any other CC's I should be including?

Thanks.

When working on GM/XG files back in the 1980s-1990s we would separate the CC messages by just 005 clock ticks. They are never a problem - what is however, is putting down one instrument and picking up another (ie., Bank Select and Program Change) Those messages are what you have to careful of... particularly switching Drum kits. a VOICE with 73 Elements does take a few more milliseconds to be recalled than your typical 8 Element Normal Voice.

When you open the can of worms that is PROGRAM CHANGES, you have to be ready to break out your MIDI Jedi Knight Merit Badge and learn to be consistent and methodical about placement of commands. You cannot request a new instrument without allowing time for the Event to take place... the number of clock pulses can vary depending on the TYPE of Voice and the tempo and how busy the current SONG is... General rule of thumb: If you "thought you heard something" --- you did! Placement must be done carefully.

Control Change messages can be separated by as few as 005 clock ticks - we settled on that just to be consistent. When editing a Track you could know exactly what clock tick each command was placed in the Setup Bar. You can create your own convention. The CC's you should include should be any that you are using in your music. There is no set number of CC's you should be including, it all depends on what you are doing.

MIDI manipulation is powerful - if it is complicated, that is only because what you are attempting requires attention to detail. Because MIDI messages must be setup sequentially - that is, a message must appear in the track before it can be effective and cause the desired change. You may want to activate the CHASE function so that when you rewind to a particular point in the SONG your controllers and program changes and PB are properly reset for each track.

This is found by pressing [SEQ SETUP] > Press [F4] OTHER > Set the SONG EVENT CHASE to "lookup" your Program Changes, PB and Controller events...

That is some very informative background information Yoda, er Bad Mister. 😉

I haven't tried it with a drum kit (literally) full of samples - yet - but I can see your point as to allowing more time for it to load. And I did not know about the SONG EVENT CHASE which looks to be very helpful in this situation.

So, having said that, back to my original problem. Would this method of inserting a voice interfere with either assigning a new arpeggio and getting it to work, or using the arpeggio assigned to the voice and getting that to actually work. That is what I am seeing.

Now if I can just locate that darn MIDI Jedi Knight Badge I'll be all set!

May the MIDI be with you.

So, having said that, back to my original problem. Would this method of inserting a voice interfere with either assigning a new arpeggio and getting it to work, or using the arpeggio assigned to the voice and getting that to actually work. That is what I am seeing.

You can use one Drum kit for the first part of the SONG, and if the timing allows have the sequencer PC event change to a new Program on that Track. This is not a problem other than having the musical rest required to pull off the change.

The fact that you recorded the Notes manually, or you have one of the Arpeggiators lay down the Notes, is of no consequence. Remember you are recording MIDI data. At any point you can use the ARPEGGIO to record data to a Track. At any point YOU can choose to record data manually to a Track. Don't make the fact that you are using an ARPEGGIATOR to lay down the notes confuse you, once they are recorded to the Track no one will ever know! (The point I'm making here is that to the Event List the Note-On Events do not identify their origin). You can even use the PUNCH IN and PUNCH OUT feature to ensure that the arpeggio records only in the measure region you desire.

So you can record the Drums all the way with one Drum Kit and then anywhere (convenient timing-wise) you can insert a Yamaha PC Event in your track to have the sound switch.

This also means that you can, as in your example, advance the Transport to measure 011, Setup the Arpeggio you wish to record and start recording from there. When you advance the Measure counter to a specific spot you are telling the sequencer to begin from this point. RECORDING will also begin from this location. If you have already placed the Program Change ahead of measure 011, then it will play back and make the appropriate change just before the data begins for it at measure 011.

But you do not have to place the PC first... in fact, it make more sense after you record - so that you can ensure that it does not cause a missed drum stroke. Typically, the PC event must be somewhere in the last 32nd Note of the previous bar (60 clock ticks before the bar line). Your mileage will vary with tempo.

The thing I was warning you about is, now that you have changed the Program, going back to the top of the Track you'll need to have a PC event there as well ensuring the original kit is recalled. You can place your PC either before or after you record the data. Just as long as they are in place when go to PLAYBACK.