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On the FMX side of things

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So no one is really talking about the FM synthesis part of this amazing machine. Is there a reason? Does anyone know of any video/audio recordings of original sounds made from the FM engine?

I have a couple questions, because I believe I'm not understand what the montage is in regards to the FM-X/fm matrix part. So as I have been playing around with the montage at my local dealer, I believe I've made a naive misunderstanding about the FM engine. I was set on the idea that it was like FM8 in regards to routing carriers and operators to wherever you please, along with feedback and so on. HOWEVER, now it has come to my attention that there are 88 preset algorithms of which you CANNOT change, but only choose from.

That being said, it also means you can't start from a simple sine wave and create/sculpt your own sound. IS THIS CORRECT!? I am not sure and continuing to go back and forth to my local store and figure this out.

This is not a "MONTAGE CAN'T" post....I simply don't fully understand what the FM side IS. Aside from the motion control aspect, are the sound design capabilities truly endless with just the FM matrix capabilities?? Someone please help educate me and not sound as insane about this.

Thanks Yamaha and whoever else can help out!

 
Posted : 17/05/2016 12:33 am
Bad Mister
Posts: 12303
 

Thanks for the question.

Please have a look at the latest edition of the Music Production Guide (PDF)

It takes a tour of the history of FM in the first article and brings you right up to date with the FM-X, the latest edition of the technology, in the second article. If you then have specific questions post back here.

The ability to create your own Algorithms becomes an issue for none but a small few. The flexibility in source material via the Spectral Forms and Spectral Skirt parameters means complex harmonics can be generated by any/all Operators if you wish. The single Feedback loops appear only to provide backward compatibility with the plethora of DX-style FM data available. But the spectral form/skirt system allows any operator the ability to create the complex waveform obtained by the feedback loop.

In the original 6-Operator FM it required at minimum a "short stack", Modulator atop a Carrier to generate a Sawtooth (all harmonics) or Pulse Wave (odd numbered harmonics only)... Now any Operator can generate a wide array of source tones...

Even in the FM-X engine Performances, many of the Presets use just 6 of the 8 Operators, allowing you to further customize the program. The exciting thing for me, (a longtime FMer) is that I can modulate any of the Operators with almost anything. The first thing I tried was take one of those perculating arpeggios, and instead outputting the data as audible notes, I used its audio energy to modify the Operator Level of two Modulators in an FM PAD sound... The results kept me in headphones for hours, playing around with possibilities. I then used another arp's rhythmic bursts to Pan the Carriers in the stereo panorama, and it was sunrise by the time I came up for air!

I've been into FM since 1983, and have had real fun in exploring its possibilities, and to discover these new possibilities is uplifting. Because almost any rhythmic thing does something interesting- there is no limit to the possibilities, and most every thing you try is relevant. Also now that the interface is more "common knowledge", programming FM will not just be for the few, I think it has potential to draw those traditional afraid of what they consider rocket science.

When I was showing musicians DX7 FM back in the 80's many were seeing menus and parameters in a screen based operating system for the very first time. Seriously, not many people had computers back in 1983, and information in a screen on keyboard was brand spanking new - it was the first time I ever read words in a screen of a keyboard. We've come a long way since it was dubbed "hard" to program. Now calling up a parameter and changing its value is commonplace, literally child's play. It wasn't in 1983!!!

 
Posted : 17/05/2016 3:57 am
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I am new to FM and followed your link Music production guide , within this guide on page 12, title Montage FM-X guide part 1 basic, it quotes a tutorial for download, is this link available now if so could you please provide the link would be greatly appreciated Thanks in advance.

Page 12: By the way: The tutorial Performances used in the following examples will be available as a free download to all MONTAGE users as soon as the instrument is available.

 
Posted : 17/05/2016 5:16 am
Hans-Peter
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Hey Harold,

thanks for your request ...

Harold wrote:... it quotes a tutorial for download, is this link available now if so could you please provide the link would be greatly appreciated Thanks in advance.
Page 12: By the way: The tutorial Performances used in the following examples will be available as a free download to all MONTAGE users as soon as the instrument is available.

We will provide the download within the next days and we appreciate your patience.

Thanks,

 
Posted : 17/05/2016 8:14 am
Hans-Peter
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As promised:

The free MONTAGE "FM-X Tutorial Performances" can now be ordered by writing an e-mail with the subject "MONTAGE Free" to:

montage@easysounds.de

Immediately after registration you will receive an e-mail from EASY SOUNDS containing the download link for the activation of the content.

Have fun! 😉

 
Posted : 17/05/2016 5:07 pm
Joel
 Joel
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Mail send, thank you Hans-Peter 😉

 
Posted : 17/05/2016 7:14 pm
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BM,

THIS IS THE ANSWER I WAS LOOKING FOR. Thank you for the lengthy response. Highly appreciate it. I will get back to you if I have any further questions. And Harold, is this download only for Montage OWNERS? Thanks everyone!

 
Posted : 17/05/2016 9:19 pm
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QUICK QUESTION: As I've read so far, it sounds like you were able to CREATE your own algorithms in the DX7....is this true? If so, is this true for the Montage as well? That is one of my main questions I haven't fully had answered yet! Thanks!

 
Posted : 17/05/2016 9:50 pm
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^^^^^^What I mean by this, is literally choosing how many operators you want running/what modulators you want and where they will ALL be placed/and it seems like spectral skirt and spectral forms means you can pretty much choose what wave shape you want for each. SO, is Montage capable of being as flexible in regards to operator/modulator routing as FM8....that is my only understanding of FM for the current time

 
Posted : 17/05/2016 9:56 pm
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I did as instructed received an email for User: and Password: that was provided after input pop said quote
The user name or password you entered for this area on easysounds.macbay.de:80 was incorrect. Make sure you’re entering them correctly, and then try again.

 
Posted : 17/05/2016 10:28 pm
Kiwi
 Kiwi
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Grant wrote:

QUICK QUESTION: As I've read so far, it sounds like you were able to CREATE your own algorithms in the DX7....is this true? If so, is this true for the Montage as well? That is one of my main questions I haven't fully had answered yet! Thanks!

Grant, I can't answer for the FM 8 but I will say that the DX7 did not allow for your own algorithms. You were given 32 algorithms to work with.
Having said that, you were not required to use all 6 operators in a given algorithm. You could drop the level in the modulators and carriers that you didn't want to be present in the sound.
Montage has 88 algorithms (as the FS1R did). And unlike the DX7's 6 operators/algorithm, Montage's algorithms contain 8 operators/algorithm.
Like the DX7, you're not obligated to use all 8 operators.

A while ago I started going through Montage's algorithms to see if there were identical algorithms to what the DX7 has. I didn't get through them all before my attention was redirected but i didn't find any "exact" common algorithms between the Montage & DX7...however.
I only (up to that point) found 1 DX7 algorithm that I couldn't replicate by turning off (dropping the level out) on those operators in the Montage offerings.

There are 88 algorithms but hundreds or thousands of combinations because again, you're not obligated to use all 8 operators in a given algorithm.

Hope this helps.

 
Posted : 18/05/2016 12:57 am
Kiwi
 Kiwi
Posts: 0
New Member
 

Harold wrote:

I did as instructed received an email for User: and Password: that was provided after input pop said quote
The user name or password you entered for this area on easysounds.macbay.de:80 was incorrect. Make sure you’re entering them correctly, and then try again.

It worked for me (I'm assuming I received the same User/Password combination.)

 
Posted : 18/05/2016 12:59 am
Posts: 0
Eminent Member
 

I got the tutorial Thanks for your response

 
Posted : 18/05/2016 5:09 am
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Have enclosed both the algorithm charts for the DX7 (32 x 6 Op) and the FS1R (88 x 8 Op)
You can compare if any are the same for Montage as per pages 169 - 172 of the Montage Data List.

 
Posted : 18/05/2016 9:01 am
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Have enclosed the algorithm chart for the DX7 (32 x 6 Op).
Can compare if any are the same for Montage as per pages 169 - 172 of the Montage Data List.

Attached files

 
Posted : 18/05/2016 9:09 am
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