studio wrote:
(Also, very glad to hear from another V-Synth user—I guess I'm hanging on to mine.)

I'm using the D50 engine inside the XT more than the V-Synth engine at the moment. I built a D50 Editor and it's a beautiful and expressive synth when you get into the nitty gritty of programming it. I will definitely be going down the V-Synth rabbit hole soon for its sample/re-sample manipulation possibilities.

studio wrote:
Did you copy over similar envelopes, FX, and whatnots from similar kinds of Montage patches, or did you re-build them from scratch for each of your synths' samples?

I'm not sure what you mean here. I simply recorded the analog synths then cut out samples from the (many and long) recordings, created 2 and 4 octave up versions of the samples where applicable (montage can only pitch up a sample 2 octaves), added loop points and pitch mapped them using John Melas Waveform Editor and then filled the User Memory with them. (I actually have many GBs of samples so I have to choose which ones to fill Montage with at any given time).

Now my Max Msp Montage Editor software comes into play...

I can randomise the analog samples across all (or selected) 64 Elements of an 8 Part Init patch on the Montage.

I can also randomise (within specified ranges) many of the settings (not all yet...) eg Envelopes, Filter, FX, Velocity Sensitivity etc etc settings for each of the 64 Elements, for each of the Part offsets, and for the Common offsets.

I've made it possible to automate (and randomise too) the creation of User Curves and assignments of Part and Common Assign Knobs and the Super Knob's interaction with the Common Assign Knobs.

Auto-mapping these to volume for each Element enables is the ability to cross fade (via an XY MIDI controller) between all the 64 Elements. This is a hugely powerful thing let me tell you! It's quite amazing!

Entirely new 8-Part Performances can be auto generated with the click of single button.

Using incredibly detailed, high quality samples of the analog synths is the thing that makes this all worthwhile. The Montage plays back the samples with exceptional quality and all the sonic detail that the samples contain. There is no compromise with audio quality here. It sounds incredible.

If you so desire, you could use this software to automate and create patches using the built in factory Waveforms too. But the audio quality doesn't match what I'm getting with my own samples.

Using the Montage in this way causes the AWM2 polyphony to be used up very very quickly however. So I've made an auto-Element Mute system that mutes Elements that aren't being heard due to the XY position. I've made a few XY widths to this so that for example 1, 4, 9, or 16 etc Elements can be unmuted at any given time freeing up polyphony.

The sound design and morphing between sounds in realtime is endlessly inspiring. I guess though that it really depends on the samples you fill the Montage with.

I've also made a very similar editor for the FMX engine, allowing randomisation of most of the settings (with specified ranges) at the Operator, Part and Common level. And the randomisation of Parts stacked in various ways like a TX816 and auto mapping SuperKnob and Assign Knobs to be able to cross fade between different FMX sounds, this is automatically done in stereo by auto-doubling the Parts in a variety of configurations and with automatic control of panning depth across the 8 parts.

My Montage provides endless joy 🙂

studio wrote:
It's also interesting to hear that you're pairing your Montage with the Native Instruments libraries since I was thinking of possibly getting the NI Kontakt S61 Mk2/Komplete11 bundle someday. Any ones in particular you like pairing with your Montage? (e.g., Massive/Form/Razor patches, Session Horns, Cinematic-series, etc.)

None in particular no. I just go with the flow and whatever inspires in the moment or whatever is most practical for the task at hand.

Jeff wrote:

I use a Jupiter 80 on the bottom tier and Montage 6 on the top. A combination I love sonically and functionally but the Jupiter is so bulky and heavy to lug around at my age!

Omnisphere 2, Halion Sonic 3, OPX II, Korg Legacy and Roland Cloud all within Cantabile Performer 3 are all nice and light though and give me a huge sonic arsenal.

Good to see another Cantabile user here. It is a really flexible piece of software. Here's some pictures of my rig. The rack has my Nord G2 in, wireless IEM TX and mixer and sound module for the NUC PC which you can see on the bottom right. That little puppy can run any soft synth I have in my sonic arsenal. The monitor on the stand is a Touch monitor for Cantabile

studio wrote:

Wow! You guys have an eclectic bunch of synths! I guess I would expect nothing less of Montage owners!

Derek wrote:

I have a Montage 7 (bottom tier) and Kronos X61 (top tier) and they go very well together.

Hey there, Derek! That's cool to hear, since I have a Kronos also and was worried that having that and a Montage was too much overlap, but I've always wanted a Motif so I'll finally have that and more in the Montage.

Would be interested to hear what you think of the Virus and V-Synth as I have always been interested in checking them out.

The Virus is sick (and so, aptly-named!). The original VirusTI is 90% of what's in a TI2 (the TI2's processor is only 25% faster), so I would highly recommend you checking one out since they go for anywhere from only $1,100-$1,500 on the used market. It makes sounds no other synth does (or at least that I'm capable of getting). It's a great complement to any other sound-making machine since it can sound so different. Lots of "mean" and "scary" patches (as well as ethereal pads, but that's not what you buy a Virus for!). I'm not too savvy at programming so I rely a lot on presets and others' patches. That's why UVI's Synth Anthology 2 (my only soft-synth so far) is perfect for me—many of the best synths' signature sounds, expertly crafted by professional sound designers.

Many say that the V-Synth GT's effects can be replicated more easily by today's super soft-synths, but again, I'm not too swift at programming so that's why I'm keeping it. Again, one guy said you can make similar sounds in software, but he said doing it on a V-Synth is just more fun. That said, it's not my favorite board since its presets all sound very V-Synth-ey, and again, I'm not too smart about using its rather deep UI to create my own sounds. It's actually a really capable machine if you listen to some of the custom patches people have made on YouTube. But my Virus is my go-to weird-sound machine, and the V-Synth just kinda sits on the shelf until I decide to someday learn how to program it. Oh, almost forgot—one of the main reasons I bought the V-Synth: Its excellent vocoder!

Thanks for the info on your other synths. A Virus would be nice, and I am hoping that the V-Synth makes it into the Roland Cloud concept along with the JD800.

In terms of Montage and Kronos, I don't think there is much overlap as their sonic characters and facilities are quite different. I'm a long time Yamaha fan (CS15, DX7II, EX5, FS1r, TG77, SY77, SY99, AN1x, Motif Rack ES with PLG150-AN and PLG150-VL - I still have most of them) but, to be honest, and it may be heresy on a Yamaha forum 😉 , I went for the Kronos because in 2014 I wanted a new flexible board so I could retire my gig rack and top tier MIDI only Novation controller (to take less out),and Yamaha were not doing multi-engine synthesis ala the EX5 in response to the Kronos.

The Montage range may have sounded good, but from a synthesis perspective it did not give me anything that I did not already have in any other of the other AWM engines I had - I still think the EX5 is THE best four element AWM2 implementation, especially with FDSP), and I wanted a synth I could delve into (like the EX5) that would keep me busy for a long time, so for me the Kronos was the best synth on the market that ticked those boxes with its ten synth engines, karma, Wave Sequencing, SSD streaming of samples, etc.

Fast forward to last year and I wanted to retire my EX5 from gigging as I had suffered a PSU failure (first ever failure in any of my Yammies) and neither Yamaha or their authorised repairer could offer support for the PSU of the EX5. My solution was a cannibalised A3000 (used the same PSU as the EX5) and a second EX5 as a spare (I was doing gigs where the show had to go on!), so I was concerned about reliability of gigging a 20 year old synth. I wanted something more modern in 76 note semi-weighted form, so auditioned the Montage 7 and walked out with one 30 minutes later. I did consider a MIDI only controller for the lower tier as I was building a new gig rack that could run my VSTi "library") but I couldn't find a good 76 note controller that was current. Vendors seem to do 25, 49, 61 note unweighted synth action or 88 note weighted but not 76 note semi-weighted which I have grown up on! Given I tend to keep my big synth investments for a long time, I did not mind having to buy a Montage to get the "controller keyboard" I wanted as I get a very capable synth as well which gives me the Yamaha sound on stage as well. 🙂 With the Montage I wish the VL, AN and FDSP technologies in my EX5 had made it in there as well, but in 2017 I realised that it was not an issue for me any more given everything else in my rig (including the soft synth options), and I have learnt to love the Montage for what it is (would like to see a few OS improvements, though, which I have sent to Yamaha UK) 🙂

In terms of soft synths, where do I start? They are so much easier to sneak into the house than hardware! 😉 I have most of the G-Force synths ( the MTron and Virtual String Machine are my favourites), Arturia V collection, most of the UH-E synths (DIVA is a monster, albeit quite demanding), Omnisphere and Trillian, OPXII, and most of the XIL-LABs synths - the PolyKobol and PolyM sound great. And I can run all of those live on the PC in my gig rig via Cantabile as a live host which is also the MIDI processor/router in my rig.

ENSONIQ ASR-10 and ENSONIQ TS-10 / ENSONIQ TS-12

Derek wrote:

I still think the EX5 is THE best four element AWM2 implementation.

Absolutely. Something about it really shines. I have the SY99/TG77 and had the Motif ES as well and now the Montage, and I still use the EX5 for lots of sounds. The price-to-sonic power ratio is the best deal in the used synth market today. The Montage is a highly polished, well oiled machine, but the EX5 holds its own sonically.

Right now, the Montage 8 is paired with a Rhodes Chroma, the EX5, an MKS-70, and a pair of FS1R's. All useful in their own way.

I do not currently pair anything with Montage to keep the weight down - but I do have an EX5R. Although I wanted an EX5 due to the multiple mod wheels and "morph" feature (EX5 scene buttons that act like turning superknob - but for ALL parameters - not just one or a few assigned ones). I'm wondering if part of the appeal of the EX5 is also some of the controller features - because I see so much of the engines mentioned and not very much at all about the unique controller features.

Scott wrote:

Derek wrote:

I still think the EX5 is THE best four element AWM2 implementation.

Absolutely. Something about it really shines. I have the SY99/TG77 and had the Motif ES as well and now the Montage, and I still use the EX5 for lots of sounds. The price-to-sonic power ratio is the best deal in the used synth market today. The Montage is a highly polished, well oiled machine, but the EX5 holds its own sonically.

Right now, the Montage 8 is paired with a Rhodes Chroma, the EX5, an MKS-70, and a pair of FS1R's. All useful in their own way.

We have a lot of common ground: SY99/TG77 (you need both as they have different characters), EX5, FS1r.

I agree with you on the EX5. When I sold my boards I could not sell them before I had an EX5R to keep the sound. In fact when I was playing the EX5s before selling and had the factory sounds banks in, I went trough them and I was reminded why I fell for the synth in the first place. Of course the EX5 was a bit of a flawed diamond. Appallingly slow SCSI speed due to the processors in the way, there was not enough DSP horsepower for Performance mode for multiple "special voices" and a crazy decision to only allow you the ability to play two parts in Performance Mode from the keyboard (I did have a workaround for that). But you forgave the flaws for the amazing sound......

Jason wrote:

I do not currently pair anything with Montage to keep the weight down - but I do have an EX5R. Although I wanted an EX5 due to the multiple mod wheels and "morph" feature (EX5 scene buttons that act like turning superknob - but for ALL parameters - not just one or a few assigned ones). I'm wondering if part of the appeal of the EX5 is also some of the controller features - because I see so much of the engines mentioned and not very much at all about the unique controller features.

With the Montage being the heaviest board, the weight of the other gear is relative. 😉

The EX5 is a very good controller. In Welsh Floyd, that is mainly what I was using for, as I had the Kronos doing most of the sounds by that time. But the EX5 still whooped the butt off of the Kronos for a particular sync lead sound from its AN engine that I used for the synth lead in "Run Like Hell". I could never get the Kronos AL-1 engine to sound as cutting, yet smooth in oscillator sync mode.

And there was something about my adapted EX5 Stereo Piano patch that suited certain songs better than the Kronos piano engine (but the Kronos engine was gorgeous for songs like Great Gig).

So, yes a very good controller. The Montage is not bad in that respect either, but the issue about its MIDI modes has been well discussed on this forum, and I think Yamaha could do better here (hopefully in a future OS update). That issue doesn't bother me, as all of my stage gear is MIDI connected via a PC running Cantabile, which can do any MIDI processing/mapping that I need, so I just keep the Montage in single channel mode and let Cantabile do the MIDI work.

Until recently, I only paired my Montage 8 with softsynths including Diva, Ominisphere/Keyscape, Falcon ... and Jamstix 4 (for drums). About six months ago, I got a Novation Peak 8-voice polyphonic synth, which I'm loving! It has a high number of dedicated, logically organized controls which makes it much more fun to play than the softsynths. Its sounds as deep and rich as any analog synth out there (in my opinion) and has a very broad range of sounds ... thanks to some new technology that very effectively combines digital and analog technology. It's a great complement to the Montage in many ways.
I also recently got an Expressive E Touche (to the lower left of the Montage keys in the pic). This takes expression (including pitch-bend) to a whole new level and works great with Montage, Peak and softsynths.
Finally, I added some effects pedals ... Source Audio's LA Lady, Lunar, and Nemesis. I find these a bit higher quality than Montage's built-in effects (which are great) and, because of where I've mounted them, they are easy to play with during performance. They're also highly programmable and sync-able via Midi. I use them as the primary effects on leads and still use Montage effects for everything else.

Nice gear setup there. 😀

I do wonder about another module (why I was asking about the Virus above), but think I need to stick with the Montage/Kronos/Nord G2 Engine/All my VSTis combo until I exhaust those possibilities! 😉

We are truly spoilt when you think what was available in the 70s when most of my favourite music was made.

I have a CP5 on the bottom tier (eventually you figure out the architecture - its absolutely awesome), a Montage 7 in the middle and a Nord Stage 2-73. Just for aded excitement I have a Roland XV5080 module which I trigger from the CP5.

I have recently added iMIDIpatchbay which I run from my iPad - this gives me total control in a live environment, can't be happier with my rig.