Hello again. I've researched the Manuals etc: but all I can find is that an illegal file is one that cannot be used or cannot be loaded. Well, I know that. What I need to know is what caused it to become illegal, and what can I do about it? The file was originally my User Bank on the Montage, which I saved to USB in the normal way, and it seemed to save normally. No problems, the red bar progressed as usual until it was (presumably) saved, and the Montage 'All' screen re-appeared as usual. But it won't re-load ... Help!

Hi Rod,

There are a couple of things in your first post that are unclear. And therefore could be your cause. Somehow I’m quite confident that you will find your error if you recount your steps properly.

Let’s try to translate what’ve done

Hello. I'm in trouble again. Been re-structuring a Library, loaded from USB to the Montage, no problem.

Apparently, not.

Dumped it to User, and deleted the Bosendorfer Pfs (the Waveforms deleted themselves).

”Dumped” is a word usually used when MIDI BULK DUMP is used, why are you using it here, did you “dump” anything... dump being moving data via MIDI. Or is that just a coincidental use of a word, and actually something you did not do? You didn’t actually “dump” anything did you? Was a computer/tablet involved? Do you mean “Load”? Do you mean “Library Import”? And Waveforms do not “delete themselves” that is a false statement.

Waveforms can be “deleted” - the process is done manually by executing a “Delete” routine or an “Initialize User Data” routine
User Bank Waveforms can be overwritten, by simply loading a new File to the User Bank.

Can you tell us how *you* think they “deleted themselves”? They cannot “delete themselves”?

Then combed out about a hundred Pfs not wanted in that Library-to-be, and deleted those.

Now you again say *you* deleted Performances... we assume you did so properly this time, by navigating to the “Contents” > “Data Utility” > “Performance Folder”... and then selected the ones you wanted to remove by marking them with a check, and then executed “Delete”.

Not even this “Deletes” the Waveforms... just because you delete a Performance that uses a Waveform, does NOT delete the Waveform. Other Performsnces might still use the Waveform. You know this, right.

Then created a new Library saved to USB of the remainder (about 500 Pfs).

Here we are going to assume you, first, verified that your data in the User Bank played correctly, and you should know exactly how many out of the 640 Performances you created (it’s listed in the Performance Folder, how many User Arpeggios are in your User Bank, how many Motion Sequences, how many Live Sets, how many Waveforms.... by checking these folders you wil “know” exactly what will be included in your .X7L (LIBRARY) File when you create it. You create it by saving the current contents of the User Bank as a “Library File”. What name did you give you new Library File?

Then deleted the entire User Bank on the Montage, intending to load the original Library again from the USB and import to User, so that I could comb out a few other Pfs for saving as another Library to USB.

We’ll no you didn’t! Let’s go over the how and why...
you say you “deleted the entire User Bank” how... perhaps you meant you “Initialized User Data” - if so please say that, or did you manually (unnecessarily) “delete” approximately 500 Performances. Or did you simply Load something else directly into the USER BANK.

It sounds like you started over. What is different from what you did and “starting over” - you loaded the “original Library” so to me everything you did previously doesn’t count, is that correct. You basically “started over” - is that correct? Is that what we are to take away from this...

There are no other Libraries loaded on Montage. Zero. None. The Waveforms (which did not delete themselves this time) occupy 23.3Mb.

Waveforms never delete themselves so if there are any Waveforms in your USER Bank, they will be listed in the “Contents” > “Data Utility” > Waveform Folder. The “original Library”, do you know for sure what’s in that Library?

So tried to load the same Library that I had loaded before from the USB. I get a message that says 'Illegal File' and that's it. It won't load. Any ideas on what;s gone wrong this time, please? Why is the same file that loaded before now illegal? I will now go out for a screaming fit ... back soon ...

As you seem to know an Illegal File is one containing data that cannot be loaded by the type you’ve selected.

Please identify the name and origin (author) of the “original Library” File.
What three characters appear after the dot in the file name. For example .X7L
Can you post the file?
USB drives can fail, remember keep your data away from electricrostatic shocks, strong magnets, washing machines... etc although the message received when this happens is different. Illegal File is a specific message... either something is misstated or some step is left out, is my best guess without seeing the data.

The file was originally my User Bank on the Montage, which I saved to USB in the normal way, and it seemed to save normally. No problems, the red bar progressed as usual until it was (presumably) saved, and the Montage 'All' screen re-appeared as usual. But it won't re-load ... Help!

Earlier you state it is the “original Library” - but now you state it was “originally my User Bank”... I contend it can’t be both.

In future posts... please use the three characters after the dot when describing a File, because even if you don’t know what type of file it is, the File does. Now is it the “original Library” or was it originally “my User Bank , which I saved to USB in a normal way”???

What is the “All screen”? Not familiar with anything called the All screen...

Illegal information! lol

Thankjs BM for your thoughtful reply. I tried to keep it short! As to your questions ... by 'Dump' I intended to convey 'Import to User' - agreed it's not a good word! No computer of any kind is involved in any of this - just Montage. The 'original' User Bank consisted of 627 User Pfs (including 15 Bosendorfer based ones). The 'Waveform' folder showed 939Mb of memory used - so I started by deleting the Bosendorfer Pfs (UTILITY - Contentrs - Data Utilty - Job - select files to be deleted). Then I deleted the Waveforms associated with them (manually as you say) and it showed 23.3Mb used. Sorry, I was wrong about that. You train the brain!

So at this point my 'original User Pf Library' was still intact on the USB, so I deleted that (UTILITY - Contents - Store/Save - Library File - Job - Delete). Then I created a new Library from the User Bank - now minus the Bosendorfer Pfs. (UTILITY - Contents - Store/Save - Library File - New Library). This Library I named 'Rod Bank 01 23.3Mb' and it duly appeared on the USB as that with the extension .X7L. I normally try out a few Pfs before saving, but I can't swear to that!

Now this is where the problem could lie. I have NOT loaded that Library back to Montage - the User Pfs were still on the Montage, so I did not need to load them back from the USB. I'm wrong there too. Your step-by-step does enforce clarity! But it saved normally and appears perfectly normal in the listing.

My 'original' User Bank also contained a lot of initially corrected Pfs that I had not allocated prefixes to, so my next job was to delete these from the User Bank (Pfs). Yes, properly, UTILITY - Contents - Data Utility - Performance - Select those to be deleted - Delete. Maybe 100 or so of those, which left around 500 Pfs (no Arps, no Motion Seqs, no Live Sets, and 23.3Mb Waveforms). With these I created another new Library on the USB as before, named Rod User 01 23.3Mb which duly appeared with the extension .X7L.

Sorry for the confusion about deleting Waveforms, but I don't think I did anything wrong?

The next job is to re-load the User Bank, now on the USB as 'Rod Bank 01 23.3Mb.X7L', import to User, and delete all of the Pfs that have my prefixes, which are now stored on the USB in the Library 'Rod User 01 23.3Mb.X7L'.

That's when I hit the buffers. Trying to load 'Rod Bank 01 23.3Mb.X7L' results in a message 'Illegal file'. I cannot load it.

I have loaded another Library complete, no problems, and started (then Cancelled) several others. They all worked normally. Including my last one 'Rod User 01 23.3Mb.X7L'. Does that give you a better idea of what I did and how, and if so, does it suggest any cause for my current predicament? It is not a total disaster - I can re-create the lost 100 or so initially corrected Pfs over time. If there is no solution, then I must delete the offending Library, and do the work again! But I'd worry that the same may happen again if I don't know what happened the first time!

The 'original Library' was indeed 'originally my User Bank' complete with Bosendorfer Pfs - that's now gone, never to return.

Thank you for your time and trouble, and please stay well ... !

Thankjs BM for your thoughtful reply. I tried to keep it short! As to your questions ... by 'Dump' I intended to convey 'Import to User' - agreed it's not a good word! No computer of any kind is involved in any of this - just Montage. The 'original' User Bank consisted of 627 User Pfs (including 15 Bosendorfer based ones). The 'Waveform' folder showed 939Mb of memory used - so I started by deleting the Bosendorfer Pfs (UTILITY - Contentrs - Data Utilty - Job - select files to be deleted). Then I deleted the Waveforms associated with them (manually as you say) and it showed 23.3Mb used. Sorry, I was wrong about that. You train the brain!

So at this point my 'original User Pf Library' was still intact on the USB, so I deleted that (UTILITY - Contents - Store/Save - Library File - Job - Delete).

I got this far and had to stop.
The Bosendorfer Library is at maximum about 400MB so how your instrument goes from 939MB to 23.3MB is a mystery worth looking into. That does add up.

Again, I guess I wasn’t clear... “my ‘original User Pf Library’” is about as misleading a term as you can dreamup when discussing MONTAGE. What are the three letters after the dot? If you give them then you don’t have to make up a term like “my original User Pf Library”(sic). Is it a .X7U File or a .X7L File? Is my question clear?

Next you say you deleted it? Why would you delete it. It is on the USB stick, correct. Unless you were running out of room on your USB stick, in general don’t delete files. It does nothing for you but get rid of a file.

_A file, if a Library .X7L is a file that can be used to “install” Waveform data to Flash. It’s a “finished product”. If you purchased it, copy it to your computer and keep it in a safety folder. If it is one you spent hours on creating yourself, copy it to your computer and keep it in a safety folder.
_A file, is a User .X7U is a file that can be restored to the internal User... it either contains backups of your most recent work, or things you are still working on... in which case, unless you are short on room on your USB stick should be kept just because it is “not finished” data. But you went out of your way to delete it. Why?

Please realize deleting the file on the USB stick has nothing to do with the process you are involved in managing data in the MONTAGE.
(Other than, if you made a mistake you no longer can go to this file to start over).

“Rod User 01 23.9Mb.X7L” what a name...

Take the dot out of your file name - see if that works. Round off to 24Mb (lol).

Also, another convention to take (if you want to keep the decimal) is to use the unit as a decimal place.

23M9 would be 23.9MB (note: Mb usually means Mega Bit. 1MB = 8Mb - because there are 8 bits in a byte. not a big deal, you know what you mean).

1G75 would mean 1.75GB. 0M5 would mean 0.5MB. 5M0 would me 5.0MB

This convention is often used to label voltages in schematics (3V3 = 3.3V, 5V0 = 5V, etc)

Hello Jason - Hahaha! I just report the facts, man! The whole Library (627 Pfs) used 939MB of Waveform memory. I deleted only the 15 Bosendorfer based Pfs (leaving 612) and the corresponding Waveforms (all starting with 'Bozy'), and the figure dropped to 23.3MB. (I accept your 'Mb' and 'MB' definitions).

I should perhaps have used the term 'my original Pf User Bank' which is better - to me it means one thing only - all those Pfs I have created ('my') in the User area of Montage. These had been saved to USB as a Library (.X7L) - I never save as User files to avoid accidental wiping out of any current User Pfs on the Montage. This Library had been re-loaded and then Imported to User - hence the 'User', 'Bank', and 'Library' confusion forced upon us by the Montage system.

I deleted the Library (dare I say 'original') of 627 User Pfs on the USB because I never wanted to use it again. Surely that makes sense? You know that on the Montage you cannot delete Pfs from a Library (.X7L) - it's all or nothing. It was first modified to create a new Library I do want to use again.

I admit my naming system is utilitarian, but it tells me all I want to know - Rod User = all my own work, and 01 (or 02, 03 etc:) = near to full capacity, and 23.3Mb = Waveform memory used by that Library (jury's still out on including this).

Tried losing the decimal point, no change. Still illegal file. I have the same format in another Library (Rod Bank 01 23.3Mb.X7L) and it loads OK.

I guess we all do different things in different ways to achieve different goals. Montage accommodates us all (with a little discipline!). Serious glitches are rare, but this seems to be one of them. I think I must resign myself to losing the stuff I haven't salvaged ... c'est la vie ... stay well ...

Hahaha! I just report the facts, man! The whole Library (627 Pfs) used 939MB of Waveform memory. I deleted only the 15 Bosendorfer based Pfs (leaving 612) and the corresponding Waveforms (all starting with 'Bozy'), and the figure dropped to 23.3MB.

Im just going to comment on one issue (there are so many)... figure out why this is the case and you will solve *your* mystery.

Do you have that Library file? It contains your "Illegal" data!

Hello BM - solved all the mysteries! Tried to load 'that' file again - one last try. Told me it was illegal - only one answer - off with his head! So I simply deleted the whole thing ... then it got worse! I tried to re-load the Library that contained all my salvaged User Pfs. About 500 of them. I'd checked previously that it was 'legal' by starting the loading process (went fine) and then cancelling it after about half a minute - it re-wound itself (I think it deleted from the Montage what it had already loaded). This time I wanted to load the whole thing. The red bar progressed about 80% of the way - and stopped! The USB has a little LED light that blinks while it's working. That stopped too. I left it alone for 30 minutes - no change. I read the Manuals, getting dire warnings about turning the power off in the middle of a load etc:. Didn't help any. So I tried to Cancel (tap the 'Cancel' pad) - wouldn't cancel. Wouldn't 'Exit' either. Nor did it re-start. So I pulled the USB out, and switched off. Switched on again and everything was back to normal. Except I have now had two failures to load - that calls the integrity of the USB drive into question. Jason mentioned that, as a result of which I have shielded the powered hub as an extra precaution for the future.

So I have now lost my entire collection of User Pfs. Two years worth. First thing is a new USB drive. Then start again - but this time with the benefit of hindsight and two years patient instruction from you and Jason and other members of this excellent Forum. I bet I'll replace everything better in only 1 year - but please don't go away, just in case ... never rains but it pours ... keep well ...