I'm new at this too, and I don't deal with multi's, just single patches, but it seems like its all the same type of command. I guess the type of controller you are using would make a difference in how to give my response, since decimal, hex and binary are all used interchangeably depending on the controller. But what might work if you use the number system in the MSB, LSB, Program table of the Motif-Rack XS Data List is if you send the following:
Of course all on the same port send; cc 00 63 cc 32 68 pc {from 0 to 127} (whatever your multi is). The first cc sets the MSB, immediately following is a cc setting the LSB and then the multi patch change you want.
Hope it works for you.

I'm new to the Motif Rack XS but not MIDI. I've been programming MIDI system exclusive and every other kind of MIDI message there is for more than 25 years. Actually I'm of the opinion that there are 3 possible explanations for why it doesn't work for me.

1. Typo in the MIDI Data book
2. Poor English translation for what actually is being implemented (manuals are often written by people who have never touched the instrument)
3. There is a bug in the Motif Rack XS OS v1.4

As I stated above... When I use the same process in Voice Mode I can change the Voices in any of the 10 Voice banks, but it doesn't work for the Multis, even though the Data Book states it should.. so I was hoping Phil would respond and help me out.

Joe H

I have followed the MIDI Data Table in the Data List book of the Motif Rack XS. I want to select Multis remotely via a MIDI hardware controller.

When in Multi Mode... The Bank Select Table states that I should send the following messages to select Multis.

MSB cc00 = 063
LSB cc32 = 068
PC = 000 -127

When I send these messages, it changes the Voices of the 4 Multi Parts rather than selecting (changing) the Multis.

Following the the same Bank Select Program Change procedure when in Voice Mode... sending the LSB = 00 - 10 followed by the PC # all works as it should and can select the Normal Voice for each bank.

What am I missing?

Hi Joe,

Press [UTILITY]
Select "General"
Cursor down to "Layer 1-4 Part"
Turn this feature = Off

From the Owner's Manual.....
The "Layer 1-4 Part Switch" - Determines whether or not the Part 1 – 4 voices of the selected Multi are sounded simultaneously as a single Part. If this parameter is set to “on,” the receive channels of the Parts 1 – 4 will automatically be set to the same value as the Receive Ch (Basic Receive Channel) parameter in the Utility Voice MIDI display of the Voice Mode. For details on the procedure, refer to the Quick Guide on page 40.
Settings: off, on
note: If this parameter is set to “on,” the actual “Receive Ch” settings of the Part 1 – 4 will not be updated from the last settings.

Now instead of behaving like a Motif XS keyboard in "Performance" Mode, the Rack XS will recall the Multi programs 001-128 according to the Data List. A total of 384 Multi programs (128 x 3 banks) are provided on the MOTIF-RACK XS Editor. In the factory settings, only the 128 Multi programs of the Preset 1 bank are loaded to the USER 1 bank of the MOTIF-RACK XS.

If you are not going to use the Motif-Rack XS as a 4-Part Performance player, set the "Layer 1-4 Part Switch" = Off, and initialize the MULTI programs for multi timbral use.

When shipped from the factory, the MOTIF-RACK XS contains a full set of specially programmed 128 User Multis in the User Bank. If you wish to initialize all settings for a selected Multi, press the [ENTER] button while holding the [MULTI] button.

Hope that helps.

Hi Phil,

That doesn't do it... but rather what I would expect it would do.

By turning off the Layer Switch, it now selects the Voice for Part 1 when sending on channel 1. When I set my controller to channel 2, it selects the Voice for Part 2 of the Multi and so on for Parts 3 and 4.

What I'm trying to do is remotely select the Multis 1 - 128 using Bank Select and Program Change messages. I can do this with my MU128 Performances, and would expect this is possible with the Motif Rack XS (?)

The MIDI Data Table for Bank Select shows the following:

MSB 063 LSB 000 - 008... Selects Normal Voices for Presets Banks 1-8 and User Bank (in Voice Mode)

MSB 063 LSB 068... Selects User Multis (in Multi Mode)

The messages work in Voice Mode for all Banks, but do not work the same in Multi Mode. Rather strange we can't select a Multi remotely.

Joe H

Sorry, you are having difficulty getting this to work, but I can assure you the message is correct! 63/68 for MULTI

Can you test this with something other than your controller. Say a DAW or any other device. I'm thinking perhaps the MSB and LSB messages are not both being sent and received. If the LSB is not seen the very last value sent for LSB will be used and just the program in the Part slot will be affected... only when 63 and 68 are received will the entire Multi change. Make sure these MSB/LSB are set to send, and verify they are set to be received.
Let us know

Hi Phil,

I have verified the MIDI messages being sent by the Peavey PC 1600x Controller. I used a MIDI monitor on the PC to capture the messages sent. They are correct.
MSB 63 LSB 68 followed by a Program Change. As I stated above this works perfect in Voice Mode to Select Voices in any of the Voice Banks.

I also looked to see if this could be done via system exclusive... doesn't look like it.

My Motif Rack XS shows OS v1.4 as the current version of firmware. I hate to do a hard reset because I will loose the Multis I've loaded so far, but I'm wondering if this would fix the problem?

Joe H

I'm sure you mean firmware version 1.04.0

Yes, I understand you when you say you can send messages to the the Motif-Rack XS in Voice mode and it selects correct programs from the various Banks. I understand. And it is very curious.

But just to eliminate possibilities, do you have another method of sending the Bank Select and Program Change as a test?
Also what MIDI channel are you sending the MULTI Bank Select/PC?
What is the current Basic Receive Channel (Voice Mode).

Yes, firmware is v1.04. I have no other means to send the Voice messages to the sound module.

The Voice MIDI is set to channel 1 for transmit and received. Everything works fine when playing Voices or playing Multis using my S970 as the controller keyboard. Everything syncs when I'm using the Motif Rack XS Editor. I've been doing this stuff a very long time and can say with absolute certainty the Motif Rack XS is receiving the correct Bank Select and Program Change messages. I think it would be helpful if someone reading this thread can test this out also and see if they are getting the same result I am.

I will reaffirm here... when I send the correct Bank Select and Program Change messages to the Motif Rack XS it changes all 4 Voices in Parts 1 -4 of the Multi simultaneously when the 1-4 Layer Switch is turned On. If I turn it Off, then only Part 1 (on channel 1) is effected (the Part 1 Voice is selected and can viewed on the sound module display).

Regards,
Joe H

I have no other means to send the Voice messages to the sound module.

Everything works fine when playing Voices or playing Multis using my S970 as the controller keyboard.

Seems you DO have a means to send this message.

And let's get on the same page, I am sending these Bank Select and Program Change messages to my Motif Rack XS as I write these, and I do this for a living 🙂 like fulltime! 🙂

Anyway, try playing this short little midi file and see if when plugged into your Motif Rack XS it doesn't change the MULTI.
The file attached is zipped. Please unzip and load to your S-970 as a Standard MIDI File (.mid)

Hi Phil,

Thanks for the MIDI file. I played the file and get the same results as before. The file sets the Motif Rack XS Multi Voices for all 4 Parts to GM 002 Rock Brite Piano. I changed the Multi from the front panel several times to different Multi numbers and played the MIDI file. Each time I got the same results. No matter which Multi is selected, the MIDI file changed the Voice to GM 002 Rock Brite Piano for each of the 4 Multi Parts.

So... if this is the way Yamaha intended for it to work, this is disappointing. Since you have access to all of Yamaha's instruments, can you confirm that when you send the same message it calls up the correct User Multi, or do you get the same result I do?

Joe H

But what MULTI number was selected? Multi 002 that's what the message does.

Create an initialized Multi in MULTI 002: here's how
Recall MULTI 002, hold [MULTI] + [ENTER] this creates an initialized Multi for MULTI 002
Please select several instruments for the 16 Parts and then NAME and STORE it to MULTI 002

Change the MULTI to 030 or any other MULTI.
Play the .mid file, it should recall your MULTI as stored in 002.

Phil,

No Multi is selected when I play the file, the Voices for all 4 Parts are changed... that's all. I already did what you have suggested. I selected different Multis from the front panel and then played the MIDI file. Every time I did this what happens is that the Voice is change for all 4 parts as described above for the current Multi that I had selected.

The Bank Select / Program Change message is NOT selecting User Multi 002, it is selecting GM 002 Rock Brite Piano for all 4 Multi Parts.

Joe H

I'm sure you checked but is Bank Select enabled in the Motif-Rack XS?

Phil,

The Bank Select Switch, Program Change Switch and Bulk Receive Switch are all ON. I bought this module two weeks ago used, there is a learning curve with any new and unfamiliar instrument, but this is not a case of "user error". As I noted above I've been reading MIDI Data Format Tables and programming MIDI since around 1992. I'm a Power User with all my gear. But I also know there can be weird quirks with MIDI and sometimes a factory reset is the way to correct things.

Going back to my original post and question regarding sending MSB 063 - LSB 068 followed by PC 000 -127 which is supposed to allow us to remotely select the Multis. if the answer is yes, then the module is not responding as it should. Though reluctant, because I don't know what all will change (factory defaults) ... I'm wondering if a hard reset might fix this problem.

Regards,
Joe H