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Motif ES - System / Insertion Effects - Using Reverb for different parts, A/D within a mix

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thomas
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On my Motif ES working with either Pattern or Song mixes, whenever I adjust the control knobs for a part's reverb (and chorus), am I adjusting the level (send?) of a system (vs insertion) effect for reverb? If I want to change the type of reverb from say stage to room, am I correct this is a system effect category change that only applies to an individual part, or do ALL parts of that mix always share the same (assignable) type of system effects (reverb and chorus?)

 
Posted : 18/10/2019 9:57 pm
Bad Mister
Posts: 12304
 

On my Motif ES working with either Pattern or Song mixes, whenever I adjust the control knobs for a part's reverb (and chorus), am I adjusting the level (send?) of a system (vs insertion) effect for reverb? If I want to change the type of reverb from say stage to room, am I correct this is a system effect category change that only applies to an individual part, or do ALL parts of that mix always share the same (assignable) type of system effects (reverb and chorus?)

Here’s a way to help think about it... System Effects (Reverb and Chorus) recreate the environment. If the Parts are musicians with instruments, then their INSERT EFFECTS are each musician’s personal effect processors... for example, the guitar player has a distortion and a wah pedal, the organist has a rotary speaker and an overdrive... no one else uses the *personal* effects of the player accept that one individual... but all the musicians share the room acoustics because they are all usually in the same room.

What is called the “Chorus” is really better called ‘time delay’ Effects. Both it and the Reverb recreate the place in which all the musicians gather to play.

Now nothing says you can’t use different reverbs but realize it is science fiction. When you listen to a band you locate the musicians (near or far) by the reverberation. You can tell how far a sound is away from you by the time delays as the sound reflects off of the walls, ceiling and floor.

If you place a Reverb as an Insertion effect, you can make that instrument stand out from the rest. This is done at times with lead or melody sounds. Remember, there is usually a good (traditional) reason for things in audio... but you can break the rules if and when it works for you.

 
Posted : 19/10/2019 12:27 am
thomas
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Phil, Thanks for this......So generally I should not want /need to mix reverb types, However, it can be done as individual inserts NOT at the system effect level. The ES system effects keeps all musicians in the same room, correct?

 
Posted : 19/10/2019 1:40 pm
Bad Mister
Posts: 12304
 

I am still left with two questions; 1) Is the Reverb & Chorus settings that I make from the Control Knobs both System Effect adjustments? In other words, If I push the System Effect Bypass button, should the ES then disconnect/remove ALL reverb that a added with the Control Knobs

Bypass means you have eliminated those effects from the signal routing. Press it, listen. Answer your own question. I think I know what has you confused.

2) Is there only one Reverb and Chorus System Effect type allowed per Mix when working in Pattern or Song Mode? I understand that I want all musicians playing in the same room so I really should never want more than one type, but does the Motif still allow me to make a mistake and mix different System Effect types within a Mix?

You understand the part about the same room. You misunderstand that Effect Types repeat.

Say you want to put one of the instruments in your ‘band’ in a totally separate room. You will find listed among the INSERTION EFFECTS reverb types. Applying a Reverb Type as an Insertion Effect will allow that one sound to be in its own room.

Same is true of CHORUS EFFECTS you’ll find the Types repeated as INSERTION EFFECT Types. If you select “Delay L,C,R” as an Insertion Effect, just the one Part will have access to it... it literally is *inserted* on that one Part. If you select “Delay L,C,R” as a SYSTEM EFFECT all Parts will have access to it via “Chorus Send” amount available to each Part.

Insertion Effect - for just the one Part
System Effect - everyone has access via the SEND (like a mixer with two Auxiliary Sends on every channel, one for Rev, one for Cho).

 
Posted : 19/10/2019 3:15 pm
thomas
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Still trying to get my head around system effect reverb. Please check me.....I set send amounts for how much of each voice to send to a shared reverb system effect. Then I edit all the reverb parameters for this shared system effect. I then adjust a total shared return level for the combined system reverb of all voices sent to the shared reverb. This whole return is wet and then combined with the unprocessed /dry signal for each voice....Right?

 
Posted : 19/10/2019 6:46 pm
Bad Mister
Posts: 12304
 

There is an individual Send available to each channel.
The is a stereo mixed Return coming from the Effect... the Wet signal... it get mixed to the main (Dry) Stereo Output.

The stereo output of the Reverb is a ‘ghostly’ composite of all the signals you send in. Heard by itself, it is very much like being in a distant dimension, one that lacks clarity, every thing sounds out of focus. This Wet signal does not get returned to the individual channel... rather this ghostly Wet signal is merged with the main Dry Stereo signal just prior to the Output.

 
Posted : 29/10/2019 4:03 pm
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