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Background on GEX key technology

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Posts: 773
Prominent Member
 

And I want to listen for the infamous fan

I ran two tests at two different times - each time putting my ear (yes - the good one - DOH) against the case in three different places (didn't know exactlly where the fan might be.

1. First test was just after I unboxed it and set it up.
2. Second test was just after I turned it on

Couldn't hear any fan and don't have, or plan to get, a stethoscope to run any more tests.

The caveat, of course, is that those tests are totally worthless if Yamaha uses a thermal trigger for the fan. In my tests the M wasn't really under any load. And this day and age you probably need to put a pretty good load on it before the temps will reach a level where the fan would come on.

I don't know that is the case - but the latest computers and SSDs I work with usually have thermal monitors the power on the fans and/or change the speed, based on actual cooling needs.

 
Posted : 14/10/2023 11:59 pm
 Paul
Posts: 0
Active Member
Topic starter
 

Just wanted to add one caveat because I've seen a few folks on other forums glom onto "Grand Expression".

Grand Expression Modeling is a Yamaha digital piano technology. It is part of the DP synthesis and responds to key movements including the triple sensor system employed in the Clavinova range.

The ability to track key movement continuously is a big deal and is a feature of the very upper-end digital/hybrid pianos.

Montage M8x does not have Grand Expression Modeling. Yamaha would shout about it, if that were the case. And, if they're not shouting, they should. πŸ™‚

All the best -- pj

 
Posted : 16/10/2023 5:26 pm
Posts: 773
Prominent Member
 

Montage M8x does not have Grand Expression Modeling. Yamaha would shout about it, if that were the case.

What they did say is more of a whisper than a shout:

In addition, the keyboard supports software updates, which enables the future development of further techniques and articulations beyond Polyphonic Aftertouch.

Makes me think they are headed in the 'modeling' direction at least.

 
Posted : 16/10/2023 6:07 pm
Posts: 207
Reputable Member
 

Andrew, please, verify:

"It is 84 13/16 inches from the two outermost (low A, high C) key edge."

I was approaching my Fantom 8 to compare when I saw (84+13/16)*2.54 are 215.42375 centimeters.

Using a caliper, I have obtained the following dimensions:

White key upper width: 22.45 mm.

Black key upper width: 10.6 mm.

Two white keys upper width: 46.05 mm.
Have to be very careful as keys approach
each other if not held.

Hence distance between white keys: 1.15 mm.

Total lenght A0-C8: around 122.55- 122.60 cm, measured,
although the data above reflects it should be 22.45Γ—(7Γ—7+3)+1.15Γ—(7Γ—7+3βˆ’1)=122.605 cm.

Mmmmm...almost matches.

So, around 48 57/250 inches.

????
????

 
Posted : 16/10/2023 7:34 pm
Posts: 773
Prominent Member
 

Andrew, please, verify:

LOL! - Thanks for catching that - had the tape measure going right to left and I was reading 48" upside down so I read it as 84.

I'll correct it in my reply above.

 
Posted : 16/10/2023 7:38 pm
Posts: 207
Reputable Member
 

[quotePost id=123873]

Andrew, please, verify:

LOL! - Thanks for catching that - had the tape measure going right to left and I was reading 48" upside down so I read it as 84.

I'll correct it in my reply above.
[/quotePost]

No problem as long as you keep playing piano
and have no relationships with NASA, Space X
and the likes.

Remember when they mixed pounds and kilos ?

Or the issue was miles and kilometers ?

No, no...units (pounds-seconds, or lbΒ·s) for thrust, while another team used the metric system (newton-seconds, or NΒ·s) for thrust.

Anyway...Long live Newton !!!!

????
????

 
Posted : 16/10/2023 8:29 pm
Jason
Posts: 7909
Illustrious Member
 

I'm guessing these patents would be related:

https://patents.google.com/patent/US5612502A/en
https://patents.google.com/patent/US6121535

 
Posted : 16/10/2023 11:03 pm
 Paul
Posts: 0
Active Member
Topic starter
 

[quotePost id=123881]I'm guessing these patents would be related:

https://patents.google.com/patent/US5612502A/en
https://patents.google.com/patent/US6121535
[/quotePost]

I'll see your two patents and raise you two:

U.S. 11,398,210 B2, July 26, 2022
U.S. 11,657,791 B2, May 23, 2023

We've all seen the speculation about GEX/PAT coming eventually to M6 and M7. What if Yamaha throws us a curve with something completely different as described in these two patents? The inventors were heavily involved in the Montage (gen 1) development...

Watch out for "pantograph-type elevating structure” where the player can depress independently the front and rear parts of a key.

All the best -- pj

https://sandsoftwaresound.net/yamaha-multi-touch-patents/

 
Posted : 17/10/2023 11:12 pm
Jason
Posts: 7909
Illustrious Member
 

During the early MIDI 2.0 plug-and-play event Yamaha was showing off a Motif XF with the keys modified with some aftermarket apparatus that detected finger position along the key and did different modulations based on where the finger was. I don't think it was multi-touch but certainly multi-zoned (and seemingly continuous). I would say that there is some card showing by this.

 
Posted : 17/10/2023 11:22 pm
Posts: 773
Prominent Member
 

Seems the Ribbon Controller on the M8X has a 5 position version of this that you configure with software. See page 244 of the ops doc.

 
Posted : 18/10/2023 9:58 pm
Jason
Posts: 7909
Illustrious Member
 

Link to the sensors on each key (Motif XF) I referenced earlier:

https://yamahasynth.com/forum/montage-going-midi-2-0#reply-78353

Video links in that message are still valid. This all was MIDI 2.0 being demonstrated 4 years ago using Motif XF and Montage.

... And it looks like Touchkeys has multi touch too.

 
Posted : 18/10/2023 11:27 pm
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